Subject: MAX Digest - 29 Nov 1999 to 30 Nov 1999 (#1999-342)
Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 00:00:11 -0500
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There are 13 messages totalling 489 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. subdividing an integer? (3)
  2. noisy powerbooks
  3. trigger puts spaces in symbols! (2)
  4. pluggo plug ins & vst obj
  5. videotracking?
  6. x-fade in archive?
  7. powerbook audio problems
  8. problem with digi hardware
  9. crusherX-Live! real-time fog synthesizer
  10. Additive synthesis control


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 01:19:43 -0500
Subject: Re: subdividing an integer?

<fontfamily><param>Geneva</param>Hey Sukandar,

</fontfamily>Your patch works fine except I want to be able to specify
how many sub-divisions there are, so it is not fixed at 3
sub-divisions. The number of sub-divisions should be a variable.

Of course this variable should only be allowed to be as large as the
integer that I am trying to sub-divide and not larger.



>hi steve,
>this should work, have checked it up to 20
>lemme know if there's bugs
>also curious if there's more elegant solutions


Date:Mon, 29 Nov 1999 22:28:56 -0800
From:Amy Knoles <altmuse@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: noisy powerbooks



> In my case definitely not. The noise is a fairly complex modulated sound. It
> may well have a hum component, but this is difficult to detect. It sounds a
> lot more like some form of RF interference. It also pulses between two
> levels in an irregular but repeating pattern. I wondered whether some
> circuitry dealing with allocating power between computer and battery
> charging (or some such) might be at fault. Sometimes these things can be
> exacerbated by ground loops, though.

I recently had to re-format my hard drive and found that when I re-installed my
scanner softwareI started to get a crackle every 15 seconds or so out my PB
output...same software, same computer, new noise....I created a seperate
extensions file for when I need to scan, and keep it off when I do music. You
may look for something like that in your system...

Good luck!



Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 01:09:19 -0800
From:Peter Nyboer <pnyboer@SLAMBASSADOR.COM>
Subject: trigger puts spaces in symbols!

Any suggestions on how to strip a leading space in a message? I have made
the unfortunate realization that the "trigger" object puts a space before
any symbol that begins with an integer.
For example, sending the message "1 1 10" into "t b s" will give me " 1 1
10". Yes, there is a space character in there. Yes, this totally hoses
everything--the message is directed to "route," which errors "route does
not understand '' "
Please help!!! My brain (and patch) is stuck!


Peter Nyboer
"If I had the power....
to make a woman....
--Johnny "Guitar" Watson


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 10:17:59 +0100
From:Peter Castine <pcastine@PRZ.TU-BERLIN.DE>
Subject: Re: subdividing an integer?

On around 28=AD11=AD1999 22:13, mbase@EPIX.NET said something like:

>How would I make a simple routine that will allow me make all the possible=

>subdivisions of an integer where I specify the number of elements in the

I don't have a solution off hand, and the patch Sukandar sent may well
work (haven't tried it yet). I just mention that the problem of
partitioning has been handled in some mathematical and (!) musical
literature, and is pretty well understood. So, cracking a book might give

you some more insights. If you're interested in pointers, I'd suggest
[Babbitt, Milton. 1973-74. Since Schoenberg. PNM 12 (1-2):3-28.] as a

Briefly squinting at Sukandar's solution, I'm wondering if an approach
that used Peter Elsea's LObjects might not work a bit more smoothly. All
those Uzis make me a little nervous, but maybe that's just me.

Sorry not to have a more concrete contribution. This is one of those
things that I've thought a bit about without ever having had
time/motivation to sit down and find a solution.



Dr. Peter Castine| The World-Wide Web Site of the 26th
4-15 Music & Technology| International Computer Music Conference is
| now on-line! <>
| Enjoy!


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 11:55:44 +0100
From:Domenico Sciajno <d.sciajno@TIN.IT>
Subject: pluggo plug ins & vst obj

i must have miss something but i really don't understand whether and how it
is possible to use the pluggo plugins within max/msp.

i tryed with the vst obj without success, is there a different way?


Domenico Sciajno


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 15:34:50 +0100
From:mit <mikael.stavostrand@STOCKHOLM.MAIL.TELIA.COM>
Subject: videotracking?


I'm working on a sound/video installation piece and are thinking about
using videotracking to control/generate midi, wich is then connected to

does anyone know about any videotracking software wich could be useful?

best, mikael.
-- = . - . . -...-
m. stav=F6strand skolv. 4 3tr 121 32 enskededalen sweden fax: +46(0)86693=


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:46:57 -0700
From:Kevin Walker <kwalker@XMISSION.COM>
Subject: Re: subdividing an integer?

>How would I make a simple routine that will allow me make all the
>possible subdivisions of an integer where I specify the number of
>elements in the subdivisions?

Do you want a max patch, or would something in c/perl/basic/whatever
work for you?


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 11:21:50 -0500
From:Stephen Kay <sk@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Subject: trigger puts spaces in symbols!

>Any suggestions on how to strip a leading space in a message? I have ma=
>the unfortunate realization that the "trigger" object puts a space befor=
>any symbol that begins with an integer.
>For example, sending the message "1 1 10" into "t b s" will give me " 1 =
>10". Yes, there is a space character in there. Yes, this totally hose=
>everything--the message is directed to "route," which errors "route does=

>not understand '' "
>Please help!!! My brain (and patch) is stuck!

Prepend the '1 1 10' with any other symbol, then strip it off after outpu=
i.e. run '1 1 10' into a prepend symbol, then from the 's'
output of the trigger, run it through a route symbol. You get back the
'1 1 10' without a space.

Stephen Kay


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:54:57 -0800
From:Jeff Rona <jrona@EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: x-fade in archive?

Can someone tell me where in the MAX archives is the patch someone did for
doing a crossfade on an audio loop? I have a vague memory of it showing up,
but can't find it. Thanks.


Be, Hear, Now


Date:Sun, 28 Nov 1999 20:13:25 +0100
From:greg <grego@RHIZ.ORG>
Subject: Re: powerbook audio problems

hi all,
i´ve tried the Opcodes sonic port optical with OS9
the result was very noisy, not in time and maybe a destroyed pair of
activ computer speakers.
I´ve asked at opcodes manny times about the release date of the mac
drivers for the port - no answer.
so i gave it back end of november.
does anybody know about any usb-audioport for powerbooks?
by greg

> I've had good luck so far with USB audio on Windows laptops. Sorry
> to go a bit off topic, but I wonder if anyone is using the Opcode DAT
> port on a mac with Mac OS 9? Audio support has supposedly been added
> at this point, but I wonder if this box works with it?


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 21:11:51 +0100
From:Werner Funk <werner.funk@T-ONLINE.DE>
Subject: Re: problem with digi hardware

Automatic digest processor schrieb:

> Date:
Sat, 27 Nov 1999 19:02:02 -0500
> From:
Alex Burton <burton-raw@ZEEP.COM>
> Subject: problem with digi hardware
hello list,
i'm trying to get a digidesign 882 I/O (the 20bits flavor) running with
> MSP. The system works fine with protools, so it's really an MSP/driver
> thing...
the digidesign direct i/o is sitting besides Max. When starting up, i se=
> "trying direct i/o", and then "error -6011, using sound manager...".
this has been tried with the digidesign INIT that's included with max an=
> the one that was already there.
any place i can learn what -6011 means? Is it an MSP error or a Digidesi=
> error?

Don't use the Digi direct I/O driver, use the direct I/O included with MSP=
So, with adac~ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8,you have all 8 outs of your 882.

Hope this helps.

- immer auf der Suche nach dem ultimativen Klang:
- toujours =E0 la recherche de la d=E9licatesse du timbre:
- siempre buscando al sonido sublime:
- always in search of the ultimate sound:

Klangwerkstatt Werner Funk Stuttgart


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 20:46:42 +0100
From:=?iso-8859-1?Q?b=FCro?= stelkens <bs-muenchen@STELKENS.DE>
Subject: crusherX-Live! real-time fog synthesizer

To everybody who is interested in sound software:

I want to introduce my new shareware programm witch you can use to
create innovative electronical sounds and rhythms:

* crusherX-Live 1.22*
* real-time fog soundsynthesis for PCs *
* buero </stelkens>, J. Stelkens*
* Download:*


crusher-X is a shareware program whose powerful fog synthesis algorithm
enables you to synthesize very complex and cool waves. Based on
traditional granular synthesis, crusher-X can be used as a synthesizer
or as a versatile effects unit. You can create sounds with the internal
oscillators or external files as well as input real-time stereo
soundfiles. Internal feedback loops allow self-oscillation within


The new crusher-X algorithm (we call it fog synthesis) is based on the
traditional granular synthesis algorithm invented in the early 1950s. In
granular synthesis, short (e.g. 50 milliseconds) sound fragments, "the
grains," come from a fixed file buffer. The starting time, length and
silence between the grains can be modulated. More than one grain at a
time is possible, so you can create complex sounds "clouds" from a
single soundfile.

The most significant difference between granular and fog synthesis is
the floating sound buffer which allows real-time input and output. In
this floating buffer the grains are created. You can apply many unusual
parameters to the grains such as pitch, filter, pan, reverse, and limit
- all with a simple, flexible interface.

All parameters can be modulated by internal oscillator sources, whose
configuration can be saved as crusher-sheets. A feedback loop inside the
algorithm enables very complex and non-linear sound processing. Also, a
multiple Undo/Redo function permits nondestructive work and encourages
experimentation with crusher-X.

Although crusher-X is a very complex and sophisticated program, it is
very inexpensive shareware. But also without registration you can have
mutch fun while testing the program.

I hope you have fun creating crusher-sounds,
i=B4m more than happy for criticism and feedback,
Best wishes,

  1. Stelkens

P.S. If you want to be removed from that list, please give me a little note.
Thank=B4s for your patience!


- Dipl.- Ing. Joerg Stelkens-
- buero </stelkens> muenchen-
- in der [alten conditorei]-
- Adlzreiterstr. 14-
- 80337 Muenchen (Zentrum)-
- mail:
- info:
- privat:
- b=FCro: 089/76755804-
- mobil: 0172/9613748-
- www:
- Aktuelle Projekte:-
- Crusher-X: real time fog synthesizer-
- !Download now! -
- syncMaker: synchronous AVI File(DV) Player -


Date:Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:09:27 -0800
From:Matt Wright <matt@CNMAT.CNMAT.BERKELEY.EDU>
Subject: Re: Additive synthesis control

Georg Hajdu is doing additive synthesis in MSP with data he's converting from

> But with large analysis files the performance degrades quickly, and playback
> slows down dramatically. The most likely culprit is the "coll" object which
> I use to store the amplitude and frequency data and which doesn't seem to
> handle very large files well (even on a G3).

If you look at the implementation of coll (the source to which
is an example in the Max SDK) you'll see that it uses linear
search every time you look something up.

> Does it make a difference for "coll" whether to use index numbers or a
> goto/next pair in terms of performance?

It's a linked list, so random indexing is always going to take linear time
(proportional to the number of elements in the coll). "next" is much more

What you should be using is SDIF, the Sound Description Interchange Format,
a new standard file (and network streaming) format that CNMAT and IRCAM are
pushing on the analysis/synthesis community. See details.

Lemur doesn't yet output SDIF files, but it would be no more difficult to
convert Lemur files to SDIF than to convert them to coll files. (I'll help
write this converter if necessary.)

I've made a collection of Max/MSP objects to read SDIF files, represent them

in "SDIF-buffer" objects analogous to "buffer~"s, and pull information out
into Max lists. I've been using it for additive synthesis of large data
files; no problem. In fact, the distribution I made includes additive
synthesis examples.

I just now made a link to the MSP SDIF stuff from the usual CNMAT Max page: can also find it all under the SDIF



End of MAX Digest - 29 Nov 1999 to 30 Nov 1999 (#1999-342)