Subject: MAX Digest - 6 Feb 1999 to 7 Feb 1999 (#1999-46)
Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 00:00:02 -0500
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - Interactive Music/Multimedia Standard Environments
     
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 9 messages totalling 444 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. overdrive on/off
  2. Motion capture data streaming MAYA (SGI) to MAX (MAC)
  3. Copyright of MAX Patches and Objects
  4. do-it-yourself sensor devices (2)
  5. Attach an non-USB floppy drive to your iMAC
  6. G4 = Max
  7. computer music controversy #3 (2)

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 01:45:19 -0600
From:    Ken Gregory 
Subject: overdrive on/off

>
>Is there a message to Max for turning overdrive on or off? I know this has
>been >addressed previously on the list, but I wasn't able to find anything
>on the Max >digest archive or in the manuals.

Yes, in 3.5 you can send Max the message directly, by putting the
following into message boxes connected to nothing, and clicking
them:

;max preempt 0   (overdrive off)
;max preempt 1   (overdrive on)

Cheers,
ken

PS. copy this into a text file and save it for future reference!

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 11:00:08 +0100
From:    Anthony Lewis-Brooks 
Subject: Motion capture data streaming MAYA (SGI) to MAX (MAC)

I need to know if I can stream the mocap data straight into max. Of course
the octane SGI will have to export to the MAC / MAX but is there any
protocols to observe. I a thinking of plotting to various sound envelope
points etc.
Thanks

Tony Brooks
Heibergsgade 21kld
DK 8000 Aarhus C
Denmark

tel +45 86182157
fax +45 86131858
tony brooks@soundscapes.dk
www.soundscapes.dk
Forum at www.delphi.com/soundscapes

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 02:20:29 -0800
From:    dudas 
Subject: Re: Copyright of MAX Patches and Objects

Peter Castine writes:
>Clarification of the clarification: stuff found at IRCAM's anonymous FTP
>site are not all in the Public Domain. [...] The copyright holders have,
>however, given permission to distribute the materials freely and (for
>the most part) permission to use.

You are right. Indeed, I was being sloppy when I said public domain; I just
ment that the objects were freely available on a public FTP site. Most of
these objects are still technically "owned" by their creators, who have
most generously made them available to the max community at large.

bzzt.

-R

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 13:28:52 -0500
From:    Frederic Murray 
Subject: do-it-yourself sensor devices

>With all due respect, asking such a question indicates fairly well
>a lack of experience with modern-day embedded systems technology (I'm
>not talking about do-it-yourself sensor devices).

Mmmm, Stephen, I am particularly interest about the last thing.
Anybody have link, books, articles or personal experiences about
do-it-yourself sensor devices ?

Thank you

Fr=E9d=E9ric Murray
Frederic.Murray@etu.mus.ulaval.ca

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Date:    Mon, 8 Feb 1999 06:49:31 +1000
From:    David Rodger 
Subject: Re: Attach an non-USB floppy drive to your iMAC

Peter Castine wrote:
>Anyone know if there is a similar trick [attaching a floppy] for the new
G3s?
>
>Might even be warranty-safe. Dunno.

Well, if the drives are hot-swappable, opening the box should be okay, at
least.

Regards, David

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 14:47:28 -0500
From:    Stephen Kay 
Subject: do-it-yourself sensor devices

>>With all due respect, asking such a question indicates fairly well
>>a lack of experience with modern-day embedded systems technology (I'm
>>not talking about do-it-yourself sensor devices).

>Mmmm, Stephen, I am particularly interest about the last thing.
>Anybody have link, books, articles or personal experiences about
>do-it-yourself sensor devices ?
>Frederic Murray

Sorry, I'm afraid I was only making a point that a custom embedded
system to run Max patches would be an entirely different animal
(and far more complex and expensive) than something like an i-cube
(or the sensor-box that IRCAM was talking about producing awhile back).

However, there are many on this list who have spoken before of
do-it-yourself sensor devices, and hopefully they can again post
some information for you.

Stephen Kay

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 21:50:19 +0100
From:    Roby Steinmetzer 
Subject: G4 = Max

Is it just coincidence or is there a deeper reason why the codename of the
new G4 chip is "Max"?
Take a look at it here:
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/9902/altivec-g4.shtml.

Anyway I'm looking forward to see the Max Bros. in action.

Roby Steinmetzer
Luxembourg, Europe

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 18:45:00 +0000
From:    Mathius Shadow-Sky 
Subject: computer music controversy #3

I am very surprised that musicians who should be concerned by this text,
to question their musical activities, DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT I MEAN !
Are they so closed in their own outside-controlled world that they
cannot see, hear what happened in reality, or am I living in a
dream-world frustrated by illusory reasons ? English become the
international language to communicate but nobody can understand each
other ? I thought that MAX community was more intelligent than for
example Cubase community [I have nothing against Cubase community, I
used Cubase myself]! This MAX listserv is existing only for patch
problems? Artists what are you doing? Just resolve your software
problems? What's beyond? Are you just doing your job without thinking?
What are you doing? Nobody understood my Computer Music Controversy? My
English was understandable? Do I have to re-send the text with
explanations? I hope to create a debate around these serious questions.

This is the re-re-text with no "air" and with explanations: I am not
against computer music, I am against the social system built around
computers i.e. privileges and manipulations.

"ENOUGH, ENOUGH: for whom, for which music makers is computer music ?
For music makers living under the threshold of poverty outside Western
rich countries or even inside ? What is the purpose of the Western
artist ? To fit his colonialist civilization ? To support its
imperialist ambition ? To follow the fashion, and to feed the capitalist
system i.e. the social inequalities among people on our planet ? 3% of
people on earth have access to a computer ! The gap between rich and
poor people grows too fast. Some people eat every day, some people
don't. Why do you make music with so expensive tools ? Which are even
not yours: by buying a new computer, you support the computer company.
How many labeled companies build computers ? 3, 2 soon 1 ? Who controls
who ? Who can crash who ? In how many places you can plug your computer
to make music outside Western rich civilization ? What is the role of
the artist in the society ? To decorate the "beauty" of our Western
political and economic system ? Like this caricatural example of most
Hollywood artists ! Art became a commercial propaganda for: the army,
the richest world companies, and the governments ? What became the
independence of artists ? Have they become scared of the "poverty", I
mean  detached themselves from the Western comfort ? Do they play
Monopoly game too ? Or they are just slaves, without knowing, to serve
the ambition of the concept "America" to erase all other cultures.
Everybody who is working to improve computer performances, serve the
Western ambition: one Customer-Culture for the world. Because technology
is used as an ideological weapon emphasized with internet connection.
With the computer technology you can control the people on the planet,
you can control the information: people with power are really excited by
the project ! Artist, what is your price and how much do you cost ? How
can an economic system control the creativity of the artist ? How can
you accept it ? Aren't you ashamed ? A permanent vomiting and invasion
of expensive equipment (who and how many people can support that
continuous financial solicitation to buy these devices ?) that follows
the rule of capitalist system : a non-stop buying solicitation making
obsolete what you bought not so far ! This is a part of the world
Customer-Culture: "buy and do not disturb our system." We have the
illusion that it becomes cheaper and cheaper. False. The same price (or
even more expensive) is only divided among several parts of the system.
You don't buy the instrument, you buy it in parts. (With money in part
too: the credit system ! And who takes advantage of it ? The people who
governs you.) Artists, do you sell your art too ? Where do you find
money to buy these expensive toys ? Artists, do you sell your art too ?
Which minority has this money ? 3 billion people live under the
threshold of poverty on our planet. What is music made with computer ?
To spend most of our time deciphering softwares, repair crashed system
than making music. Are you really making music for people ? For the
other 3 billion with an empty wallet ? Without following the false and
controlled economic market rules ? Who is free to create ? The computer
artist ? Who is building computers, musical instruments and selling
music, and for what ? The same big companies who indirectly control your
creativity. You have just to fit in their economic-feed-circle to feed
their power. Which music maker has access to this economic-colonialist
culture ? What is the price [not cash!!] to lose our identity and
independence by spending time with computer [not music] ? Computer tools
make us busier than ever, and this is what these few people who govern
the world want! These TOYS are supposed to be for artists ! They are
not. Which experimental artist is enough blind to play this game ? How
can you continuously upgrade and update your toys ? Where is creativity
in this activity ? COMPUTER MUSIC IS THE OFFICIAL "ART" OF THE WESTERN
CIVILIZATION. Who cares about programming in music ? The people who
govern you. Who cares about computer problems ? Music makers ? What is
this, the present of our future music, the Globalization of the Western
Music ? The universalization of the Western culture ? Are you these
supporters ? Aren't you ashamed ? When are you going to support the END
of this globalization of the Western culture from rich countries ? When
are you going to support more equilibrium among the different cultures
of the world ? Experimental Computer Music ? What a laugh ! What a lie
to ourselves ! Computer music is the result of a privilege ! [3% of
people in the world have access to a computer] And a fabulous trap for
naive people ! To keep them busy by brainwashed and dead people's mind
manipulated. The fascination for a "magical" new toy ! (Can computer
people influence non-computer people to join the controlled "magical"
club ? This is the wish of some powerful ones !). Who cares about
computer music problems and how it is resolved ? The people who govern
you, and music makers who don't know what is music for. Enough. Stop.
Too much. One hides him/herself behind technique activities !  The
easiest way to hide his/her lack of free creativity that nobody teaches
in our Western civilization because the free creativity is the worst
enemy of all kind of powers. People in free creativity cannot be
controlled. WHERE IS MUSIC FOR PEOPLE ? It's time to awake and think
about others. It's time to stop the Western globalization process. It's
time to stop the privileges and share with others. It's time to start a
solidarity among creators to stop the money-system process. It's time to
make free music under any false commercial rules or governmental
institutions that serve only the power of few people. It's time to make
music for people, not for money. It's time for computer toys makers to
join artists not the big companies (or to imitate them) which are
working to submit and control the world.

Goodby

Mathius Shadow-Sky
Le Centre De La Bombe
http://www.bburg.bev.net/civic/centre-bombe/ (no cookies)
http://members.tripod.com/~centre_bombe/ (cookies)

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Date:    Sun, 7 Feb 1999 23:20:06 +0000
From:    Ed Hartley 
Subject: Re: computer music controversy #3

As the son of a church organist, I grew up with similar ideals about what
kind of people become musicians, how they should act, what motivates them,
what art's role in society is, etc. I believed that music was, first and
foremost, a divine activity. After slaving through music school and then
going out in the "real world" and working with real professionals, I
realized my naïveté. I learned that musicians are just like any other
segment of society. That is, there are all kinds. You've got smart and
stupid ones (insert drummer joke), liberal and conservative, moral and
immoral, etc. It was a shock to find this out-to realize that musicians
would actually choose to waste their valuable practice time playing video
games, watching TV, and voting republican. It was a shock to be told that
there's only one correct way to play Beethoven. It was a shock to work with
musicians whose highest goals were to disgust and offend their audience.
It's as if they were no better than accountants, athletes, encyclopedia
salesmen, or even, believe it or not, lawyers.

To jump to the point, the problems you describe are real but they're not
limited to the sphere of music and to solve them you've got to attack the
whole society. Is top-40 radio any more mindless than a trip to Disneyland?
If I get paid for music I don't care about, is that worse than getting paid
for building widgets I don't care about? Driving a truck I don't care
about? Operating on patients I don't care about?  The impulse to need the
latest and most expensive music toys is the same impulse that drives people
to buy sport cars and fly business class. Why would someone spend $200 on a
pair of pants? Is $2000 for a reverb any worse than a $2000 couch? All my
furniture is either garbage-picked or hand-me-down. My rear end fits it
just fine, thanks. (My favorite H. D. Thoreau quote: "A man is rich in
proportion to the number of things he can do without.")

My main question you is "Yes, but what else is new?" Hype? Lizst paid women
to swoon at his concerts. Do you know why Bach wrote pieces with titles
like "Goldberg Variations" or "Brandenberg Concertos?" Why were so many
great musicians in the Renaissance involved with the Italian Catholic
church? Maybe because that's where the bread was? Did medieval farm
peasants have any more control over their destinies than modern steel
workers? I submit that they had less. Do you know that they used to chain
people to their factory machines? 70 women once died in a New York city
sewing factory because it caught fire and they were locked in. And, yes,
this still goes on in Asia, but slow progress is being made and you get my
point. Sorry, I can't help myself but here's some more Thoreau:
(paraphrased) "The only amazing thing about the pyramids in Egypt is that a
people could be exploited for so long to build them." Are things really
that much worse now?

Mathius Shadow-Sky wrote:

> I am against the social system built around
> computers i.e. privileges and manipulations.
>

How do you feel about the education system, where rich kids go to good
schools and poor kids go without breakfast?

> Art became a commercial propaganda for: the army,
> the richest world companies, and the governments ? What became the
> independence of artists ?

Again, what else is new? Artists have been selling it for years. Back when
I considered myself a professional musician, a standard joke among my
friends was "What? You're a musician, and you want to eat too?"

> Have they become scared of the "poverty", I
> mean  detached themselves from the Western comfort?

Have you ever been poor? Have you ever had no idea how you're going to eat
next week? I was there briefly, and it ain't no fun. Four chords and the
truth won't get you very far in a supermarket.

>  Or they are just slaves, without knowing, to serve
> the ambition of the concept "America" to erase all other cultures.

Sorry, but as a proud American, I take offense. After a look at this
century's two world wars I think we're basically okay, or at least no
worse. I agree with those who say that democracy is a terrible form of
government, but it's the best we've got. Ditto capitalism.

> What is
> this, the present of our future music, the Globalization of the Western
> Music ? The universalization of the Western culture ? Are you these
> supporters ? Aren't you ashamed ? When are you going to support the END
> of this globalization of the Western culture from rich countries ?

We'll stop selling when they stop buying. Okay, that's a little simplistic
but I was in Russia last month. Tell me why the street peddlers in in St.
Petersberg want to be paid in US dollars?

> When
> are you going to support more equilibrium among the different cultures
> of the world ?

When someone finds out a way to pay for it. When non-Western cultures take
it upon themselves to make it happen. I'm as distrustful as you are of
monster capatatlist global corporations, maybe more so. But I don't doubt
or underestimate their power. They exist only to make money and perpetuate
themselves. They have evolved fierce survival instincts. What would happen
if the CEO's of ATT, Ford, GE, etc. started taking your advice?
They'd be on the street in no time. The shareholders would demand it, and
they'd get it.

By the way, what the hell do you mean by "equilibrium" among the cultures?
Does that mean "Oh, those natives are so quaint, what with that hooting
they do. Let's not teach them how to build a hospital because being healthy
might change them." Or do you mean, "I like the way the cops is Moscow
stand on the street corner and pull over whoever they feel like, for no
reason at all." How would this equilibrium work? By population? By
geographic area?

> The
> easiest way to hide his/her lack of free creativity that nobody teaches
> in our Western civilization because the free creativity is the worst
> enemy of all kind of powers. People in free creativity cannot be
> controlled.

There, I'll agree heartily.

> WHERE IS MUSIC FOR PEOPLE ?

Let the people make it themselves. If they're happy in their catatonic
lives, sloughing off to boring jobs every day so they can afford a
television so they can watch ads on TV (the sad truth is that the ads are
often better) to tell them what they want to do with themselves... if
they're happy with that, who are you to criticize them and say they're
wrong? It gives you the opportunity to express your individuality, if you
want to think about it that way. Wasn't it the missionaries traveling from
Europe to "save the heathens" that started the whole western colonization
mess in the first place? (Why do you think they call it the "missionary
position?") The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

> It's time to awake and think
> about others. It's time to stop the Western globalization process. It's
> time to stop the privileges and share with others. It's time to start a
> solidarity among creators to stop the money-system process. It's time to
> make free music under any false commercial rules or governmental
> institutions that serve only the power of few people. It's time to make
> music for people, not for money. It's time for computer toys makers to
> join artists not the big companies (or to imitate them) which are
> working to submit and control the world.
>

I sometimes wish I had your idealism, because I often wonder why I'm so
cynical. But philosophically, the idea of a utopia is just waste of time. I
could go on for hours, but I think it's time I went and made some original
music on my computer.

Ed Hartley

and one other thing...

When Christofori put his final touches on this new fangled gadget called a
"piano," it way very sophisticated piece of 18th century technology.

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End of MAX Digest - 6 Feb 1999 to 7 Feb 1999 (#1999-46)
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