Subject: MAX Digest - 5 Feb 1999 (#1999-44)
Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 00:00:05 -0500
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - Interactive Music/Multimedia Standard Environments
     
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 5 messages totalling 208 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. (part 1) video sampling
  2. MAX, the hard way
  3. hardMAX
  4. Media100 ---> Trinity
  5. Hot off the ADC press...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 5 Feb 1999 22:00:06 -0500
From:    Philip Galanter 
Subject: Re: (part 1) video sampling

Avids and M100's perform many functions in realtime these days, but they
are not designed for realtime sessions...they are really post-production
oriented.

There are some amazing values these days in TV industry products for live
video mixing and effects, but they are not open programming platforms.

Firewire/DV/Quicktime on the Mac is a very potent combination.  With the DV
QT codec I am using whenever any DV Quicktime movie is played (even with
Simpleplayer) the firewire also sends out a full DV signal.

I've created some video loops and recorded them to long playing videotapes
by simply using Simpleplayer and the looping option.  No stutters or
dropped frames at the loop point.

They are hard to find, but Sony is shipping DV/NTSC conversion boxes...I've
heard everything from $300 to $500 in terms of cost.  These are firewire,
S-video, and composite video (and line audio), in/out boxes.  I am going to
try to get one of these soon.

It seems like at least some useful things could be done then just using a
Mac...I'll try to see if I can control 2 Quicktime movies from Max and do
live editing as well as looping.

Phil

>In regards to Johnny DeKam's remarks about realtime compositing, isn't
>that what the media 100 does, and on the card rather than in the CPU?
>Someone had mentioned M100 earlier, was that just a playback thing or
>would it be possible to have the M100 app open playing an EDL while
>controlled by Max either on the same or another computer?
>
>of course changing the parameters of a composite on the fly would be
>another story...
>
>dc

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Philip Galanter         New York University     phone:     212-998-3041
Associate Director      251 Mercer                fax:     212-995-4120
for Arts Technology     New York, NY 10012   internet: galanter@nyu.edu

     N Y U   A c a d e m i c   C o m p u t i n g   F a c i l i t y

Info, resources, art gallery, and more...       http://www.nyu.edu/atg/

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 5 Feb 1999 22:18:26 +0000
From:    Ed Hartley 
Subject: Re: MAX, the hard way

I think it's a pretty interesting idea and I'd like to hear more.

Ed Hartley

Sukandar Kartadinata wrote:

> Today I was asked (yet again) if I could build a box that can run MAX/msp
> patches w/o a Mac, so I thought it's about time to post this proposal /
> questionaire...
>
> h a r d M A X
>
> the basic idea:
> build a dedicated DSP-Box (or maybe use something existing) and write a
> cross-compiler to fuel it with MAX/msp patches from a Mac (or, well, PC)
>
> (possible) benefits:
> 1. integration
>         - sensor circuitry
>         - audio I/O (DAC/ADC, SPDIF, AES/EBU, ADAT, Firewire, USB, etc.)
>         - output drivers (relais, motors, extra displays)
>         - MIDI (although possibly obsolete with the other integrated
circuitry)
> 2. non-general purpose OS
>         - better latency
>         - better timing accuracy
>         - higher reliability (?)
> 3. portability / stage fitness
>         - sturdy box
>         - sturdy connectors
>         - acceptable weight
>         - less cabling
>
> questions:
> 1. Who would be interested ?
> 2. Has anyone already worked on this issue ?
> 3. Why is this insane ? Why is this great ? What are your comments ?
> Suggestions ?
> 4. Who would like to cooperate on this project ?
>
> Looking forward to your response
> Sukandar
>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> Sukandar Kartadinata
> Custom Music Technology
> Hagenauerstr. 6, 10435 Berlin, 030-44051219
> http://members.xoom.com/Sukandar/
> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 5 Feb 1999 22:37:01 -0500
From:    Johnny DeKam 
Subject: hardMAX

> h a r d M A X
>
> the basic idea:
> build a dedicated DSP-Box (or maybe use something existing) and write a
> cross-compiler to fuel it with MAX/msp patches from a Mac (or, well, PC)

What you're describing sounds very similar to the KYMA system developed at
the University of Illinois, and Commercially available - but it will always
be cheaper and much easier to use an existing OS/CPU as a host -- even if
you do all your DSP in an external box

-- You might  enjoy looking at the new single rack space "iMac in box" being
released in March --  http://www.marathoncomputer.com/

A cpu power revolution is on the horizon for the Mac - multi processor G3's
& G4's ~this year~ -- with integrated support built into the MacOS (starting
with 8.6 next month, and hardware released with the so called "Sawtooth"
generation of desktops...to quote David Z..."You should be able to cause
some real "Sonic Damage" !

--Johnny

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 5 Feb 1999 22:57:51 -0500
From:    Johnny DeKam 
Subject: Media100 ---> Trinity

> In regards to Johnny DeKam's remarks about realtime compositing, isn't
> that what the media 100 does, and on the card rather than in the CPU?
> Someone had mentioned M100 earlier, was that just a playback thing or
> would it be possible to have the M100 app open playing an EDL while
> controlled by Max either on the same or another computer?
>
> of course changing the parameters of a composite on the fly would be
> another story...

Exactly my point, I'm speaking of software-based compositing -- the effects
that Media100 does is hard-coded into the boards -- the various purchase
levels of Media100, (and Avid) is all based on how much realtime effects you
by on the chips -- thus making your editing very efficient. (no render time)

If Media100/Avid had an open SDK for their hardware, than an enterprising
developer could write MIDI/Performance sampling software that worked with
it... but they tend to keep that information a secret, because they make
exorbitant amounts of money on their proprietary software.

A future project I'm interested in (as much as I loath NT) is to write a
MIDI interface for the amazing Play Trinity Box.

http://www.play.com/

The trinity is an entire realtime TV studio in a box, with anywhere from 2
to 8 realtime input/output buses (each w/effects) in any format combination
(composite/Component/S-Video/Firewire/hardisk etc)  it even outputs 3D
graphics or can key a live actor into a virtual space - all without
rendering... absolutely insane and starting at only $5000.  and it's all
hardware too, so kiss performance problems goodbye.  It also has RS-232
control, so MIDI might be basically unnecessary (just easier to program) --
Trinity uses an NT box to control it.

Johnny DeKam

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 5 Feb 1999 23:00:59 -0500
From:    Johnny DeKam 
Subject: Hot off the ADC press...

Apple's new MIDI web page features a list of Macintosh-compatible MIDI
equipment. Opcode, Roland, Emagic, Mark of the Unicorn, and Midiman
have recently announced USB MIDI interfaces; and Griffin, Keyspan, and
MegaWolf have announced multiport PCI serial cards.

http://www.apple.com/publishing/music/midi/

------------------------------

End of MAX Digest - 5 Feb 1999 (#1999-44)
*****************************************