Subject: MAX Digest - 27 Jan 1999 to 28 Jan 1999 (#1999-34)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 00:00:00 -0500
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - Interactive Music/Multimedia Standard Environments
     
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 12 messages totalling 371 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. browser plug-in clarified
  2. COMPUTER MUSIC CONTROVERSY #2
  3. MAX and MOTU
  4. BPatcher trolling
  5. generalized clock patch
  6. memory leaks
  7. video
  8. fiddle~ crash
  9. G3 chip upgrade with MAX
 10. new objects on ircam ftp
 11. msp-forum list
 12. MAX Digest - 26 Jan 1999 to 27 Jan 1999 (#1999-33)

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Date:    Wed, 27 Jan 1999 21:20:04 -0800
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: browser plug-in clarified

By having claimed I "wrote" a Max Netscape browser plug-in,
I don't want to make the claim that I finished the thing. So,
to quote the Talking Heads song, "You can't see it till it's
finished."

David Z.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 27 Jan 1999 21:30:14 -0800
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: Re: COMPUTER MUSIC CONTROVERSY #2

Mathius Shadow Sky  asks:

>Artists what are you doing? Just resolve your software problems? What's
>beyond? Are you just doing your job without thinking what are you doing?

Some of you may have heard about the recent case of two UC Santa
Cruz students who were recently arrested on suspicion of having
held up a beauty salon and a Costco warehouse. One the students had
apparently decided that a crime spree would allow her to spend more time
on her art because she wouldn't have to get a job to support herself.

David Z.

------------------------------

Date:    Wed, 27 Jan 1999 21:35:01 -0800
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: Re: MAX and MOTU

Bill Meadows  asks:

>Is anyone sucessfully running both MAX and Digital Performer at the
>same time? I can launch both, but when I switch from MAX to DP, the
>system hangs. I imagine it has to do with running both FreeMIDI and
>OMS at the same time, but I don't know if there is a fix. (MOTU says
>they are going to make DP OMS savvy someday...)

Check to see that OMS has "Run MIDI in Background" unchecked
in the OMS Setup "OMS MIDI Setup" dialog.

In older versions of OMS, this was known as "Allow non-OMS applications"
mode.

David Z.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 00:29:53 -0600
From:    Bob Falesch 
Subject: Re: BPatcher trolling

Stephen Kay  wrote:

  [...]
> And I thing it was Peter Castine (?) who recently created some
> sort of "rhythm master object" abstraction that sounds somewhat like
> this clock patcher.

You might be thinking of rhythm_engine by Peter Nyboer
http://www.slambassador.com

  -- R. Falesch

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 00:35:59 -0800
From:    Peter Nyboer 
Subject: generalized clock patch

>1. Generalized Clock Patcher: A "tempo" based system, ...

Go to http://www.sirius.com/~pnyboer/SOFTWARE
and click on Rhythm Engine.  It allows you to set a tempo numerically or
tap in a tempo, or provide a tempo from somewhere else.  Then it breaks
down the tempo into divisions such as triplets, eighth notes, etc.  The
explanations on the web page.  Enjoy,

PEter.

Peter Nyboer
pnyboer@sirius.com
http://www.sirius.com/~pnyboer
"Now, I not some guru or Dog or anything"

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 16:08:20 +0100
From:    Peter Castine 
Subject: Re: memory leaks

On around 27-1-99 12:14, Oeyvind Brandtsegg said something like:

>I decided to check for memory leaks, using the method suggested by
>Karlheinz Essl some time ago.
>The method uses the messages to max:
>;max reset
>;max counter
>Memory leaks are shown as the difference between getbytes and freebytes,
>as printed in the max window.

I'm not absolutely sure that this is an absolutely
robust/reliable/accurate measure of leaks, but I'll take your (and
Karlheinz') word on this for the time being.

If you have access to a copy of ZoneRanger, it would be worth using this
to track down memory abuse. (It's probably only developer geeks with a
Metrowerks subscription who have this tool, although it used to be
available at FTP sites). Possibly more accurate than reset/counter.

>1. Some patches caused memory leaks, even if they contain no objects
>that causes memory leaks by themselves (e.g. if the object is placed
>alone in an otherwise empty patcher).
>These patches' memory leaks *disappeared* when the contents was copied
>to a new patcher window, and then saved over the old "bad" patch.
>How could these memory leaks have appeared in the first place, and how
>should one avoid getting into them in the future ?

Strange. Could possibly be a basic Max problem (perhaps Max is not
completely deleting some references while you are editing the patcher).
Select All/Copy/save in new document would have a tendency to iron out
such problems.

>2. After going through every single part of the patch, finally tracing
>down and removing all memory leaks that could be removed (some could not
>be removed, because some externals themselves caused leaks: e.g. bondo,
>detonate, and sprintf ...),
>I still have a huge memory leak when loading the main patcher with all
>subpatches/abstractions.

[schnipp]... also strange. But makes me wonder again how reliable
reset/counter are in tracing mistakes in memory management.

>3. Could a memory leak cause a crash, even if there's still a lot of
>memory available ?

Indirectly, yes. Like this: a memory leak is indicative of mistakes in
memory management. If code stops using a chunk of memory but forgets to
deallocate it, it is equally possibly that the same code may try to use a
chunk of memory it _hasn't_ allocated. Which might be memory that got
allocated to a different external object (for example). This latter
situation is quite likely to cause crashes.

This has been the bane of Mac programming since the first prototypes were
developed at Apple (although Pascal, which was used for a lot of very
early Mac software, makes it more difficult for programmers to shoot
themselves in the foot than C).

>4. How will these memory leaks affect system performance when the patch
>is compiled into a standalone application ? e.g. one does not open and
>close the patch itself several times, but rather quit and restart the
>application.
>

When a Mac application quits the entire memory allocated to the app is
returned for use by the system. The next launch starts with a clean
plate.

A force-quit (cmd-opt-esc) might leave some resources blocked (you know,
OMS will complain on the next launch). But even in this situation memory
leaks ought not to be the problem they are within a patcher.

If David Z. has time to respond, he can probably answer the above in more
detail and with more authority than I can. In the mean time, I hope the
above is some help.

Cheers,

Peter

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 12:14:47 -0500
From:    Jeff Mann 
Subject: video

Ken Gregory wrote:

> And, if fixing the movie object is not hard, why haven't some of the more
> experienced C programmers on this list fixed it up and shared it ( Our
> Hero!). We've been talking about this for awhile, if not a couple of
years.

Various people have done work on it, but not released it publicly (for
lack of time). By next month (March) I will have collected all the
various improvements I can find, and try to have them integrated into
one "super" movie object. So, if you have done any modifications that
could be useful, please send me a copy of the source, or just an
explanation of what you did, thanks. David Z. - you mentioned that you
will release a cleaned-up, latest and greatest version of the source if
I remember correctly. Any date on that? It would be great if I could get
it a.s.a.p, as I need to go ahead with this - with or without it - in
the next two weeks.

> -- For Video, the movie objects properly play buz video in full screen on
an
> external (TV) video monitor.

No they don't! Full-screen resolution movies (720x480) will NOT play at
all (well, ok at 1 frame per second) unless you have a movie object that
supports scaling (see above). Otherwise, Max will try to play the movie
at full size on the computer monitor as well as the video output. Which
is why Johnny says:

>  For best results I've used 1/4 screen (352x240
> mpegA) resolution...

"best results" a.k.a. works at all :-)

If anyone needs to do this *now* I can send you a version of the movie
object that will work, or just wait until March...  
mailto:jefman@utcc.utoronto.ca ||   http://www.interlog.com/~jefman
Visit the Art & Robotics Group site: http://www.interaccess.org/arg

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 14:08:00 -0500
From:    Dan Trueman 
Subject: fiddle~ crash

Yo,

I've been having great fun and getting good results from fiddle~. I am
running several interfaces that use it, and I've noticed that if I open a
second interface that uses it (closing the first, without quitting MAX in
between), when I
close that second interface, MAX crashes. This is quite consistent. If I
quit MAX in between, I don't have this problem. I'm wondering if anyone
else has had this experience, and if there might be an easy fix.

tak,
dan

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 13:08:06 -0800
From:    Nicholas Hind 
Subject: G3 chip upgrade with MAX

There's been various talk about running Max with a PowerMac G3,
but I'm thinking about upgrading my PPC 8500 to have a G3 processor, and
am interested to know if anyone has had experience with this.

Nicky Hind

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 22:37:29 +0100
From:    Manuel poletti 
Subject: new objects on ircam ftp

With a little delay (sorry), some cool new Max stuff on Ircam's ftp:

New objects by David Rokeby, including an improved "movieplus" that adds
new features to the classical Movie object;


All Eric Singer's objects now FAT, within a new "misc" folder":


New version 2.0 of MSP Granular 2.0 by Sakonda Nobuyasu:


DudasTools 1.4 (by himself) :
"The updates and fixes include: a new wacom object that's compatible with
the new INTUOS tablets now it really does work with 2 transducers like it's
supposed to listfunnel now works with lists of any size fileout version 2.1
- with some new feature I added for Zoron last year (I don't remember what)"


Enjoy...

-Manuel

Ircam Forum technical support
tel : (33) (0)1 44 78 16 05
email : forum-support@ircam.fr

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 23:05:46 +0100
From:    Manuel poletti 
Subject: msp-forum list

Hi maxers,

I've just opened a new MSP discussion list at Ircam, wich is around MSP
stuff distributed by the Ircam Forum.

To not make any concurrency to the (now airy) present list, I've suggested
to people to send there only MSP-Ircam related questions (and there are
some).

I will also report any interesting (or funky) MSP stuff or information here.

('hope I won't have to murder digitally - a thought for Chris)

-Manuel

Ircam Forum technical support
tel : (33) (0)1 44 78 16 05
email : forum-support@ircam.fr

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 28 Jan 1999 23:35:41 EST
From:    RBMengMail@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: MAX Digest - 26 Jan 1999 to 27 Jan 1999 (#1999-33)

In a message dated 1/28/99 5:00:48 AM, you wrote:

<<> Microsoft, and our experience so far with their development tools

What kinds of problems have you experienced?
>>

Get copies of Visual Basic versions 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, & 6 and try to set the
alignment property of the most basic of input objects -- the textbox -- to
right-justified.  At best, you'll be ignored.  At worst, back up everything
first.  Complain about it and Microsoft might recommend a third party
substitute (costing several hundred dollars)  Just don't buy Becubed
Software's cause it's worse.....it always crashes, at least through 6 months
ago.

R B Meng

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End of MAX Digest - 27 Jan 1999 to 28 Jan 1999 (#1999-34)
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