Subject: MAX Digest - 15 Jan 1999 to 16 Jan 1999 (#1999-16)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 00:00:04 -0500
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Reply-To: MAX - Interactive Music/Multimedia Standard Environments
     
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There are 9 messages totalling 394 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Bug in MAX "IF"?
  2. compressor
  3. MAX Digest - 13 Jan 1999 to 14 Jan 1999 (#1999-14)
  4. New Macs
  5. my personal contribution of "krapmatter" for 1999
  6. Bug in the "urn" object?
  7. curriculum development
  8.  (2)

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Date:    Fri, 15 Jan 1999 23:47:19 -0800
From:    dudas 
Subject: Re: Bug in MAX "IF"?

David Durlach writes:
>Does anyone know if this is a bug, or instead, that we are confused?

I thought this was already fixed last year, but I get the same problem as
you do.  It seems the 32-bit float is output as if it were a 32-bit int.

The following patch gives both a temporary and permanent solution:
(the temporary solution needs the unsupported external "32bit" - I don't
recommend actually using this solution, but it does shed some light on the
source of the problem)

-R

max v2;
#N vpatcher 77 78 625 423;
#P flonum 423 155 35 9 0 0 0 3;
#P flonum 409 78 35 9 0 0 0 3;
#P flonum 452 78 35 9 0 0 0 3;
#P newex 423 130 27 196617 gate;
#P newex 452 99 31 196617 > 0.;
#P flonum 287 215 52 9 0 0 0 3;
#P newex 287 190 32 196617 32bit;
#P newex 36 184 30 196617 print;
#P flonum 157 74 35 9 0 0 0 3;
#P flonum 72 184 81 9 0 0 0 3;
#P flonum 72 74 35 9 0 0 0 3;
#P newex 72 121 95 196617 if $f2>0.0 then $f1;
#P comment 72 203 180 196617 the 32 bits of the float are mysteriously
output as an int;
#P comment 283 234 135 196617 or if you want to be wierd \, you can
temporarily use '32bit' to read it as a float;
#P comment 219 105 178 196617 this is the "real" Max-way to do it ->;
#P connect 3 0 7 0;
#P connect 4 0 3 0;
#P connect 3 0 5 0;
#P connect 6 0 3 1;
#P connect 3 0 8 0;
#P connect 8 0 9 0;
#P connect 10 0 11 0;
#P connect 11 0 14 0;
#P connect 13 0 11 1;
#P connect 12 0 10 0;
#P pop;

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 16 Jan 1999 14:49:29 +0100
From:    heiniger 
Subject: compressor

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>needing to control some fluctuating levels inside my patch, i made a =
simple
>compressor using metro/avg~ to read a table object, the numbers derived =
from
>this being used to control a *~ object, through which the audio is =
passing. The
>table provides the compression curve.

>the problem is that it's a bit clicky.(less so if i slow metro down, =
but it's
>still there). does anyone have any suggestions for a clean compressor? =
it
>shouldn't be too processor intensive, as I'm close to the limit again, =
and i
>need to run several of them.

=20
a) lowpassfilter the "control"-signal (eg. at 10 Hz) and the clicks =
should go...

or=20
=20
b) use a envelopefollower (like a lowpassed square of the inputsignal) =
passing thru a lookup rather than a table.
=20
=20
wolf

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>needing to control some = fluctuating levels=20 inside my patch, i made a simple >compressor using metro/avg~ to = read a=20 table object, the numbers derived from >this being used to control = a *~=20 object, through which the audio is passing. The >table provides = the=20 compression curve. >the problem is that it's a bit = clicky.(less so if=20 i slow metro down, but it's >still there). does anyone have any=20 suggestions for a clean compressor? it >shouldn't be too processor = intensive, as I'm close to the limit again, and i >need to run = several of=20 them.
 
a) lowpassfilter the = "control"-signal=20 (eg. at 10 Hz) and the clicks should go...
 
or
 
b) use a envelopefollower (like a lowpassed square = of the=20 inputsignal) passing thru a lookup rather than a table.
 
 
wolf

------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BE415F.6B56C5E0-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:28:37 -0800 From: Peter Nyboer Subject: Re: MAX Digest - 13 Jan 1999 to 14 Jan 1999 (#1999-14) Richard dudas writes.... >Voting is a clever means to promote the illusion of freedom. >It serves no other purpose; any seeming just system is a farce. >One becomes free only upon realizing that freedom and fairness simply do >not exist. You must have been in France, or something! This sounds related to the idea that one must not wish to become enlightened in order to become enlightened. Or that voting for facism is still possible. And can you believe that people actually still buy Cadillacs? Peter. Peter Nyboer pnyboer@sirius.com http://www.sirius.com/~pnyboer "Now, I not some guru or Dog or anything" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 14:07:40 -0500 From: Bob Gluck Subject: New Macs I realize that this may be slightly off topic, if only a little, but it derives from the recent questions about the USB Macs. I am seeking advice about the question of a new G3 purchase, most specifically for use with Mac/MSP. I am frankly feeling a bit lost when it comes to determining the best decision that addresses both short term and longer term needs. It is clear that MIDI is a problem for the USB Macs, at least for the moment. Which would point me towards purchasing a slightly earlier G3. On the other hand, I wonder if that is a good move longer term, as it is unclear whether serial ports will be supported later on as USB moves in. I need a new computer soon, but don't want to make a foolish move granted the expense. Advice off-list is welcomed. Thanks, Bob http://members.aol.com/Rjgluck http://raven.dartmouth.edu/~njma/ "Creation takes place in bottlenecks... A creator who isn't grabbed around the throat by a set of impossibilities is no creator. A creator's someone who creates their own impossibilities, and thereby creates possibilities..." Gilles Deleuze ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 14:05:18 -0500 From: Nicholas Longo <71477.2332@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: Re: my personal contribution of "krapmatter" for 1999 < <Please remember this if/when you have the chance to vote... < Subject: Bug in the "urn" object? Is there a bug in the "urn" object? I have experienced some times that after a while it only send out a small subset of the numbers it should. Most recently, when given a range of 16 numbers, after some hours it only sent out 10, 11, 12, 13, and 14 (randomly). Usually I have to restart Max to fix it. I have not managed to consistently repeat the bug. Eirik Lie, Bjornerabben 9, N-0383 Oslo, Norway Email: eirikli@notam.uio.no - Tel +47 22 50 23 14 Check out my CD "12 Bilder": http://home.sol.no/home/eiriklie/Visual.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 23:28:08 +0200 From: Tom Mays Subject: Re: curriculum development >but once upon a time, when Tom Mays and I came up with the >scenario of being stranded on a desert island with only the standard >install of Max and the choice of just 10 unsupported externals, we could >only think of 7 that we absolutely couldn't live without! You CAN do pretty >much anything you need to with the standard set of Max objects (although >sometimes it can get pretty twisted). Thanks for the lead-in, Richard. As I recall MOST of those 7 were listops - some of the FIRST unsupported externals available for Max... As for Max teaching strategies, economics plays an important role. If you've got 6 or 7 students and just one computer you're not going to teach in the same way as when you've got one computer per student. I recently began teaching computer music (via max/msp) in Athens - with only one computer. My first couple of classes of introduction were actually deomonstrations of relatively simple dsp and synthesis techniques that were still too complicated to expect them to do themselves right afterward - but this got them hooked! Now the strategy is to go back to midi in/out and the basics that Richard explained, having them work in pairs or groups outside of class. I totally agree that all the "message stuff", though essential to good maxing, is too confusing for the absolute beginner. I had one of richard's "where everything went wrong" moments teaching an Ircam weekend workshop a few years ago when I pretty much "started" with messages (thinking I was providing a solid foundation) and they all struggled to understand, but seconds later forgot everything. I now know to save the inner workings theory (including right-to-left order) for AFTER the students know how to make a few basic patches - and that these basic patches should make sound (midi or otherwise). Back to Mr. Luke DuBois [who probably no longer lives in the woods if he's teaching max :) ] If he's teaching to students who already know the basics of Max, that is more difficult. The inherent diversity of Max invites many different methods and directions and intermediate students probably already want different things. Still, some important specialized topics are variable handling, iterations and looping, data storage, patch structuring (when and when not to use send/receive, how to separate the control from the "motors"), event handling, organizing the patch for performance, rehearsal considerations, efficiency, optimization, text manipulations, the user interface, organizing the project on disk (where to put abstractions, objects, colls, tables, and other files used by the patch), backing up and documenting the piece... Since I haven't contributed to the list in a while, I will add this personal note that I have left Ircam and am now in Greece freelancing from my home studio (at least that's the idea). My new email is tmays@hol.gr. Tom ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 23:57:01 -0600 From: =cw4t7abs Subject: >Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 11:04:12 -0500 >From: Christopher Murtagh >Subject: Re: your mail > >On Fri, 15 Jan 1999, =cw4t7abs wrote: >> >IMPORTANT: This list is confidential. You should not publicly mention its >> >existence, or forward copies of information you have obtained from it to >> >third parties. >> >> >> kould 1 plz klar!f! dze mean!ng ov abov +? > > This is a good question, and actually I don't have the answer. az !t = klass!f!ed undr `IMPORTANT:` perm!t zom 1 2 : who doez plz +? >I also wish Listserv would change their terminology... I'm not >particularly fond of the term 'Listserv Owner'. fr. du. luvl! demokrat!k objekt du. != relatd 2 =cw4t7abs zugezt!on +? tu = zur +? >I much prefer admin, or >something less authoritative. Ahh well. Ahh well. ou!. !ngezt whatevr = handd out b! dze konglome.rat du. luvl! demokrat!k objekt du. fr. fr. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 23:49:36 -0600 From: =cw4t7abs Subject: >Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 16:16:42 -0000 >From: Kurt Ralske >Subject: sfplay~ and sfrecord~/search path > >hi, sorry if this should be obvious.... sorry sorry sorry >with sfplay~ and sfrecord~: >how to specify search path/destination disk? >is it only done manually? + d!nam!kal! >is it possible to change path, from within max, >while patch is running? ou!. cezt poz!bl. + az ment!ond prev sfpla! = krasch rout!n when spec!f!ng 1 path d!nam!kal! + f!le = pla!ng deja. ------------------------------ End of MAX Digest - 15 Jan 1999 to 16 Jan 1999 (#1999-16) *********************************************************