Subject: MAX Digest - 31 Dec 1998 to 1 Jan 1999 (#1999-2)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 1999 00:00:00 -0500
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - Interactive Music/Multimedia Standard Environments
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 11 messages totalling 407 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  2. cor bl!mey
  3. vote to boot
  4. anti-ominity
  5. antiorp / exile / standards
  6. Ives (Was: Schumann)
  7. New Year's and millenia
  8. Serial Hoax
  9. Call for calm, solution is in the works.
 10. MAX CD mailing address (now the good news)
 11. Clairaudience??

Email to MAX should now be sent to
LISTSERV commands should be sent to
Information is available on the WEB at


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 00:22:01 -0600
From:    =cw4t7abs 

>>Date:    Thu, 31 Dec 1998 01:36:03 -0500
>>From:    Andrew Davenport BROUSE 

>>>there is a remarkable lack of depth and character throughout his entire
>>>repertoire, and it was perhaps too late that r.schumann  realized this.
>>I have to respond to this because, as someone who has an extreme distaste
>>for, and often felt oppressed by 19th century music, I feel Schumann
>>(along with Satie and Scriabin who more properly belong more to the 20th
>>century)  was one of the few bright spots of that era.

=cw4t7abs = altzo protekt!v ov ch!ldhood p!ano !konz
scr!ab!n = wrote rathr zuperb no!sz
sat!e = un4tunatel! kommerss!alzd

>>>once a student of law, never heralded for his musical brilliance in his
>>Who cares.  Charles Ives was an insurance salesman.

dze! were both humanz. 1 addtl obzervat!on az waz or!g.
dzat 1 ma! chooze 2 attr!bute !t addtl s!gn!f!kansz = 1nz cho!sz

>>>he succumbed to insanity after a decade of attempts at mid-period
>>>romantic composition and was thereafter incarcerated to the asylum
>>Along with all the other artists.

fr. = 4 r!zn akzept rout!n. ccelv doubt - !nd!kat!v ov m9nd akt!v!t!


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 00:47:09 -0600
From:    =cw4t7abs 
Subject: cor bl!mey

>From:    Gene Schwartz 
 Subject: Re: antiorp dying
>Stephen Kay writes:
>>How true.  This list is dying an ignoble death.  The cause is antiorp.


>> Basically, antiorp and friends bombarded
>>Chris Murtagh with hate-mail and other subversive tactics,
>I believe this to be absolutely false.


>Where are you getting
>this info?

pr!vate ema!lz +?

>>then antiorp
>>took off s/h/it's persona for a few minutes and said "please, chris,
>>I'll be good, let me back on the list (whine, snivel)",
>An exact quote,
>I imagine.

please, I'll be good, let me back on the list
whine, snivel, pout.

&zttz . dze wh!n!ng ark


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 08:35:08 +0100
From:    Rhys Chatham 
Subject: vote to boot

>If one looks back over the last several months, one might
>discover that nearly half of the bulk of the list has been antiorp-related
>material --
>R B Meng

>I've heard a certain list owner say that he would love to boot antiorp
>(again) if only the list could vote on it.  If it was done democratically=
>by a vote of list members,
>Stephen Kay

On the principle of "if I don't like it I don't have to read it", I've
been simply deleting any Max digests containing an antiorp string up to
now, but this story is becoming rather boring, don't you think?

Antiorp has disrupted other lists as well, I'm amazed he hasn't been
booted off this one yet.

My vote would be to boot s/he off and be done with it.


Rhys Chatham


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 00:59:48 -0800
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: anti-ominity

Some of you who enjoy Antiorp's contributions to this list might wonder
who he/she really is. Come on, admit it, you've at least thought
about it.

Well, I can't help you.

We have no user called =cw4t7abs in our MSP database. I don't have
access to the most recent Opcode database of Max users, but that
name (or anything else close) wasn't in it as of the beginning
of last year.

I certainly don't think anyone needs to buy anything to participate
in this list, by the way. But I do think it's pretty remarkable that
Antiorp developed an application in Max and MSP (called b!257+!2) that
he/she sells commercially. Because, from what I have to assume, he/she
had to quit Max every time he/she wanted to change something.

David Z.


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 04:04:35 -0500
From:    Jeremy Bernstein 
Subject: antiorp / exile / standards

There is a long tradition of communities sentencing serial violators of
"the law" to exile.  I'm not sure why, if there is general consent, exile
is not brought up for general consideration.  If we define certain
behavioral standards, and we are all committed to upholding them, then
let's get on with it, and quit taking time and emotional energy up with
this silly issue.  I for one would be grateful to eliminate this particular
irritation from my mailbox.  Please accept one vote in favor of exile.

>I've heard a certain list owner say that he would love to boot antiorp
>(again) if only the list could vote on it.  If it was done democratically=
>by a vote of list members, then perhaps the decision could be accepted
>by all, and we could get on with MAX.



Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 14:56:50 +0100
From:    Peter Castine 
Subject: Ives (Was: Schumann)

On around Thu, 31 Dec 1998 01:36:03 -0500, Andrew Davenport BROUSE said
something like:

>>Who cares.  Charles Ives was an insurance salesman.

One hears this often, but Ives was actually a little more than a
salesman. He managed (co-managed, I think, I don't have the Cowell &
Cowell biography here to double-check) one of New York's largest
insurance companies. He was the sort of person whose name business people
knew, but with whom it was impossible to get an appointment. Unless you
were Henry Cowell writing a biography;-)

Amusing that one of antiorp's unending "contributions" should eventually
lead to discussion of things vaguely musical. (As an aside to =3Dcw4t7abs:
if you don't like Robert Sch., the Bergische Gesellschaft f=FCr Neue Musik
has a competition for works that take "das vision=E4re Schaffen" of Sasha
Scriabin as a starting point. Might be more to your taste.-)




Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 14:56:52 +0100
From:    Peter Castine 
Subject: New Year's and millenia

On around Thu, 31 Dec 1998 17:20:39 -0600, Richard Dobson said something

>Off-topic, but it's almost the last new-year of the current millenium...

Surely Richard meant penultimate new year of the current millenium? I
would sort of hope that we wouldn't have people defining millenium as "a
period lasting 999.5 years" here.

Wishing all a happy and successful 1999.

Peter -- looking forward to the Berlin ICMC in the year 2000 and the new
millenium in 2001.


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 14:56:53 +0100
From:    Peter Castine 
Subject: Serial Hoax

On around 1-1-99 6:00, someone said something like:

>>Composer Webern was Double Agent for Nazis
>>By Heinrich Kincaid
>I've been told by various people that this article is a hoax.

Not only is it a hoax, it contains more errors of fact than a radio
broadcast by a certain American right-wing loonie.

Given that I have now had the damned thing in my mailbox about 50 times,
it's starting to compete with "Good Times" for the honorable position of
"most loathed bandwidth wastage."

Sheez, even antiorp is original compared with this crap.




Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 14:03:33 -0500
From:    Christopher Murtagh 
Subject: Call for calm, solution is in the works.

Greetings MAXers,

  I am currently working on a solution  (Plan 'A') to our current antiorp
and anti-antiorp dilemma, and I might have a solution that we can probably
all live with. I'm just waiting to hear back from the Postmaster at McGill
on a slight technical issue, and hopefully we can put an end to all this.

 If for some reason Plan 'A'  is not possible, I do have a plan ready 'B'
that I know the majority of people here can deal with, so, a solution is
coming... no need to fear. Either way, this will be solved once and for all
in probably less than two weeks.

So, save your energy for MAXing and holiday cheer, and please no more posts
to the MAX list. Anyone with questions, comments, etc. Please send them to
me at

 Thanks for your understanding and extreme patience through this very
tedious ordeal.


Christopher Murtagh
MAX listserv owner


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 14:15:19 -0500
From:    Christopher Murtagh 
Subject: MAX CD mailing address (now the good news)

Greetings MAXers,

 I' have had a couple of people who have offered donations towards the MAX
CD. To them I would like to say thanks very much. While this will cover a
certain portion of the manufacturing, to date, it won't cover all of it so
this is what I plan to do:

 1) I will post a page listing the dotations to date and the estimated cost
of manufacturing (starting at 500 units). This will also have an up-to-date
estimated cost per unit for people wishing to purchase the CD (should be
very cheap, I would imagine the postage for most people will be more than
the CD).

2) I will then like to gather up a list to see how many people would be
interested in such a CD (for the calculations above, I will start by
assuming 500 which might not be accurate).

3) I will then pay for the manufacturing myself and hope that I can recover
my costs by selling the CDs to people who have requested them.

There is still a chance that we might be getting enough donations to cover
the cost completely, in which case the CD will be FREE! I'll keep the list

People who are interested in submitting something, please email me ASAP to
let me know what you would like to submit and an approximate size and/or

My home mailing address for submissions:

Christopher Murtagh
58 Davis St.
Aylmer, Quebec
J9H 5C9

 Thanks, and happy MAXing.

Christopher Murtagh


Date:    Fri, 1 Jan 1999 18:34:19 -0500
From:    Tom Ritchford 
Subject: Clairaudience??

Sorry for continuing interesting off-topic discussions about
Schumann, 12-tone stuff...  ignore if desired...

=cw4t7abs  wrote:
>Richard Dobson  wrote:?
>>Schumann is interesting  - he was clearly syn-aesthetic, and also
>>clair-audient. One theory concerning his 'madness' is that he started to

Guessing the attribution here... but wait a second... clair-audience is
one of those purported psychic abilities, where you can hear something
remotely through "paranormal" means...

Can't see where you get to this...  and why would this be useful for
(Perhaps for plagarism?)

Synaethesia (senses crosslinked so that you can "see" sounds, "smell" colors
or what-have-you) seems much more useful as an ordering principle, but it
be hard to convey your actual associations to the audience...  still, the
emotional conviction would be there.


>As an example, Scherbius showed Associated Press reporters the score
>of Webern's Opus 30 "Variations for Orchestra" overlayed with a
>cardboard template. The notes formed a mathematical grid that
>deciphered into German a comparison between the neutron release
>cross-sections of uranium isotopes 235 and 238.

Read this before but still cackled wildly about it.

>I've been told by various people that this article is a hoax.

Wha??  How could you ever take something so funny seriously??  ie:

>Schonberg responded with a collection of songs for soprano and
>woodwinds that encrypted the chemical makeup of the polonium-beryllium
>initiator at the core of the Trinity explosion.

[antiorp debate part MCMXCIX]

God, this is dull... takes instants to skip/delete antiorp when
I'm busy, minutes to read when I'm not.  The Max list is hardly "dying" --
volume is low on all my lists this time of year and this is always one of
my high-content lists.

Happy New Year and a libation to all of you (and a cup of machine
oil for antiorp!)



End of MAX Digest - 31 Dec 1998 to 1 Jan 1999 (#1999-2)