Subject: MAX Digest - 15 Dec 1998 to 16 Dec 1998 (#1998-101)
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1998 00:00:01 -0500
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - Interactive Music/Multimedia Standard Environments
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 8 messages totalling 309 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Installation blues
  2. CPU bypass URGENT!
  3. G3 notebook & Max
  4. down Mry lane (2)
  5. firewire / usb
  6. OS 8.5.1 is here

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Date:    Tue, 15 Dec 1998 22:04:10 -0700
From:    John Abram 
Subject: Re: Installation blues

Thanks for your suggestions - I discovered that MAX doesn't like Micropolis
4343WS Drives!  I don't even get as far as the MAX splash screen if this
drive is mounted.  When I unmount this drive (which happens to be my
dedicated audio drive of course) Max will work as it should.  I have yet to
try switching SCSI numbers and reformatting with a different utility (it's
currently Apple's 8.1).

Has anyone else experienced problems with this drive?  I'm under-using its
Ultra-wide capabilities with a 68-50 pin SCSI adapter.

with best wishes,


Date:    Tue, 15 Dec 1998 23:32:09 -0800
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: Re: CPU bypass URGENT!

I like the subject of this message, sounds a little like the
jargon they used so desperately in that movie "The Andromeda Strain."

Louis Dufort  writes:

>I've tryed  begin~ wiyh selector~ but it doesn't work, even the help
>file of begin~ doesn't seem to work, when I put the selector at 0 the
>CPU is still running...

As an alternative, consider using mute~ on each of your subpatchers.
You should use the pass~ object before the output of each subpatcher
otherwise you might hear the classic MSP "no signal" sound when
you turn the subpatcher off.

begin~ and selector~ work in a very limited set of cases. I hope
to improve them someday.

David Z.


Date:    Wed, 16 Dec 1998 08:23:08 -0000
From:    Steve Antosca 
Subject: Re: G3 notebook & Max


i'm planning to buy a Mac G3 notebook, probably a 233 with a 2Gig IDE
drive.  can anyone on the list give me feedback on running Max/Msp on a
mac notebook.

thanks for the advice.


Steve Antosca
quicksilver music


Date:    Wed, 16 Dec 1998 14:31:36 +0000
From:    Nick Lowe 
Subject: down Mry lane

I expect you all know this, but I didn't. My 3-year-old just came back from
the library with the Dorling Kindersley Eyewitness Guide to Music, a very
pretty educational picture-book of instruments with bite-sized blurbs. The
final spread is titled "Machine music", and has instructively-captioned pix
of a MIDI cable and an assortment of then-cutting-edge gear (first printing
was in 1989): a DX7, an Akai wind controller, a Roland MT-32, an Akai
EWV2000, and (inevitably) an Atari ST. But what's this in the middle of the
left-hand page, under the legend "Software makes the computer compose
music"? - a copy of M 1.1 for Atari, with the original Intelligent Music
label, and even the serial number clearly visible (1087, since you ask).
Personally I've found 3-year-olds tend to take more readily to OvalTune,
but it's nice to see such quality brand awareness promoted among

Nick Lowe


Date:    Wed, 16 Dec 1998 11:26:33 -0500
From:    David Bianciardi 
Subject: Re: firewire / usb

Automatic digest processor wrote on 12/16/98 12:00 AM:

>Date:    Tue, 15 Dec 1998 16:12:27 -0700
>From:    baxtrr 
>Subject: Re: MAX Digest - 10 Dec 1998 to 11 Dec 1998 (#1998-96)

>much like the lone wolf devices you mentioned?

yeah, but based on an open standard, without proprietary/expensive
chipsets, and hopefully adopted by a few industry orgs (mma/aes...).  it
certainly is more palatable (to me at least)
to invest energy into a technology which might eventually benefit from
the development and marketing efforts of an entire industry over a single
company hawking their own hardware, and trying to build a revolution one
licensee at a time ;)

fact is, with few exceptions, by the time standards are adopted and
products based on them are for sale, they're obsoleted by something that
itself will take 6 years to actually come to market...I'm certainly not
putting all my eggs in this basket, it's just one of the first baskets
that looks shaped right for my applications, if you know what i mean.

>it will probably be new builds
>that follow this route

true, but not just "studios" in the traditional sense of the word.  I
would see a mixed network like this extremely useful in alot of the
themed entertainment work I do, where media and control data need to be
flying in a lot of directions at once, and also in theatrical gigs, where
distributed sound systems could be built using a big 1394 loop with with
audio "taps" feeding powered speakers with discrete mixes, etc...

One issue, the maximum transmission length is being dealt with
incrementally, but they're up to about 70 meters now over fiber, as I

>i will remember in future
>that you are easily offended

hmm...perhaps I was a bit touchy that eve, and felt jumped upon by the
tone of your comments.  i apologize for the reaction.

>and that its coming to market
>is rather like a dog walking on hind legs
>amusing to see
>remarkable in that it happens at all
>but of no great use to anyone

definitely not my stance.  USB is certainly a great development for
desktop users.  especially PC users for whom the concept of this kind of
outside-the-box bus is a novelty.
of course a few of my mac friends w/ iMacs are going to need a little
time to get over Apple's uncharacteristic abandonment of the ADB legacy.
Not too much time, though, given the benefits of that much bandwidth!

>where the facts are concerned
>we appear merely to be agreeing
>in angry tones
>which is a pity

a shame indeed.  i agree to agree more amiably.

> least one major project
>     that yamaha funded for years
>  and then quietly threw away

true of any company w/ that kind of market position, and r+d budget, who
are trying to stay ahead, no?

>but given the mma's track record
>on preserving legacy hardware
>i would be amazed at any de jure announcement
>coming from the mma
>that would hinder devices
>already in the field

good point, however I see that applying more to their refusal to abandon
"legacy MIDI" ( circ DIN 5 connector, current loop, 31.25k baud) users,
than their commitment to new transport layers...devices claiming
conformity to a standard should be interoperable, after all.  While the
USB boxes have standard MIDI on one side of the box, the USB side isn't
standardized yet, as far as i know.  my assumption is that some
manufacturers might have to backtrack a little, once a standard way of
doing things on the USB side is adopted...

>and have swapped my silk robes
>for a space suit

aren't you worried about the chafing?

David Bianciardi

212.353.3947 fax
IDRC || 415 Lafayette St || 2nd floor || NYC, NY 10003-7000



Date:    Wed, 16 Dec 1998 11:24:30 -0500
From:    Chris Murtagh 
Subject: OS 8.5.1 is here


 Don't know if you have all heard yet or not, OS8.5.1 is ready from Apple
( If you haven't upgraded to OS 8.5 yet, I would say
do, but don't use the Drive Setup that comes with 8.5. Instead, wait until
you download the upgrade before installing (it comes with a newer Drive
Setup). I have now had 2 G3s (both were formatted with FWB 2.5.2 <-- avoid
with 8.5!!) and 1 iMac (who know's why this one went bad) go wonky due to
8.5. They have since been 'tuned up' (re-format and install Apple's drivers,
 not FWB's), and they are now working really well. The new
OpenTransport/AppleTalk is wicked fast compared to 8.1, well worth the
upgrade alone if your machines are networked.

 Also, a while back, someone had mentioned running MAX on an iMac. Just
wondering if PACE will work with a USB floppy or would I have to visit Mr.
Snapcase (only with licensed software of course)?


Christopher Murtagh
MAX listserv owner


Date:    Thu, 17 Dec 1998 06:40:34 +1000
From:    David Rodger 
Subject: Re: 

>>Subject: FIMU 1999 : Call for participations  ||  call 4 zubrdonat!on
>0+2 kreez murtagh. s0ls0l



Translation: Antiorp is not going to put any of his work on Chris's CD.

David Rodger:   Audio Engineering; Pool Operations; Aquatics Training
RESEARCH -- Motion Capture in Music --
ADZOHU -- Music and Dance from Ghana --
"I'm concerned about reproduction above 20kHz, because I want to make
sure I'm not depriving my dog of a complete listening experience when
I leave the stereo on...."                            -- Matt Barstow


Date:    Wed, 16 Dec 1998 14:45:36 -0500
From:    Chris Murtagh 
Subject: Re: down Mry lane

From: "Nick Lowe" , on 12/16/98 9:31 AM:
>a Roland MT-32, an Akai EWV2000, and (inevitably) an Atari ST.

>but it's nice to see such quality brand awareness promoted among

Ahh yes. Not long ago, I remember laughing at a friend of mine when he
bought his Atari 520ST. We were into the platform debate at the time. Not
Mac VS PC, they both were crappy for music, then it was Amiga VS Atari. I
had my Amiga 2000 (still do, now a doorstop) with an FB-01 and he had his
520ST/MT-32(ooh! Multi-Timbral!). We still have 'technology' books in our
library that talk about both of these machines being the 'new cutting
edege' in computer music. More like history books now.

Dare I ask, is this the first sign of 'getting old'?



End of MAX Digest - 15 Dec 1998 to 16 Dec 1998 (#1998-101)