Subject: MAX Digest - 17 Oct 1998 to 18 Oct 1998 (#1998-40)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 00:00:00 -0400
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Reply-To: MAX - Interactive Music/Multimedia Standard Environments
     
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There are 11 messages totalling 406 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. 0;x97097097
  2. MSP & MOTU 2408 (2)
  3. Max on the BeOS
  4. vst and adc~?
  5. adcvstautobonbaszdl!fe4mz (2)
  6. check failed zgetfn
  7. granular
  8. changing the background color of a window
  9. max vs. c

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Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 00:27:13 -0400
From:    =cw4t7abs 
Subject: 0;x97097097

>Date:    Sat, 17 Oct 1998 14:45:21 -0700
>From:    Patrice Coulombe 
>Subject: Unsig~?

>How can I convert a signal value to a max ordinary message? (A kind of
>"unsig~"...)
>
>It could be useful for manipulating the output of a line~ (for exemple).

number~

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 00:48:40 -0700
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: MSP & MOTU 2408

After enduring almost daily e-mail inquiries for the last few
months asking whether MSP would work with the MOTU 2408, I'm
pleased to announce that I have in fact made the two work
together using MSP's new ASIO driver, and I thought I would share
the remarkably good results from the latency test patcher (included
with the MSP Examples).

There is no way to change the I/O Vector Size on the fly with the
2408; you have to quit Max and use the PCI-324 Console application.
The allowable sizes range from 64 to 1024 or more. Of course, the
three smallest sizes are of most interest to latency-obsessed MSP
users.

256 sample I/O buffer size = in-out 15.57ms, overhead 15-17% of the CPU
128 sample I/0 buffer size = in-out 9.77ms, overhead 20-22% of the CPU
64 sample I/O buffer size = in-out 6.87ms, overhead 24-26% of the CPU

"overhead" is a slight misnomer, it just means the observed
CPU utilization of a simple sine-wave patch.

Tests were done on a 180 Mhz 604e, actually feebler than
MOTU's minimum required system (a 200 Mhz 604e).

I'm still refining MSP's ASIO support, but if you want to try the
"beta" version that's a little awkward to use, visit the Cycling '74
news page at http://www.cycling74.com/support/news.html and click
on the appropriate link. The Read Me file explains the slightly
arcane way you have to set things up.

We've also added pluggo information and screenshots to the
Cycling '74 web site. And, we added a comparison chart (that I'll
soon need to update with the ASIO/2408 data) with information about
using MSP with various CPUs and audio cards to the MSP product
description page.

David Z.

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 00:34:24 -0700
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: Max on the BeOS

It's a little bothersome to see Antiorp repost something from
one of my co-workers that constitutes the first information that
we're porting Max and MSP to the BeOS. Of course it was my fault, I've
just been so busy I forgot to mention it.

My impression is that Be is in transition off the PowerPC
and onto Intel machines. Be received a lot of venture
capital last year and lot of the money came from Intel.
Of course, I haven't been able to get the Intel version to
install on my PC, so maybe that's not a good sign. PC hardware
is a big mess, anyone who would want to write an operating
system for it has to be a little bit insane. But...dual
400Mhz Pentium IIs...whatever their new floating-point vector
thing is called...lots of Mflops...get something that
actually works and you could do some serious sonic damage.

David Z.

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 00:40:41 -0700
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: Re: vst and adc~?

Patrice Coulombe  asks:

>Is there a reason why vst~ doesn't work with adc~.
>Should it be?
>Am I doing something wrong?

Patrice's patch worked for me.

David Z.

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 08:09:24 -0400
From:    =cw4t7abs 
Subject: adcvstautobonbaszdl!fe4mz

>Date:    Sat, 17 Oct 1998 17:54:33 -0700
>From:    Patrice Coulombe 
>Subject: vst and adc~?
>
>Hi,
>Is there a reason why vst~ doesn't work with adc~.
>Should it be?
>Am I doing something wrong?
>Thank you for a response.
>
>
>(to try my TestVST patch, just click on "plug" and choose a VSTplugin)
>
>max v2;
>#N vpatcher 9 51 1029 561;
>#P message 145 131 34 196617 mix 0;
>#P message 146 95 34 196617 mix 1;
>#P user meter~ 150 240 230 253 100;
>#P user meter~ 340 232 420 245 100;
>#P user meter~ 479 134 559 147 100;
>#P newex 428 97 29 196617 adc~;
>#P user ezdac~ 254 341 298 374 -164954634;
>#P user number~ 369 258 408 273 9 3 3 1 0. 0. 0 0.43 250 0.;
>#P newex 287 304 27 196617 *~;
>#P newex 254 304 27 196617 *~;
>#P message 225 116 26 196617 plug;
>#P newex 254 195 110 196617 vst~ none;
>#P connect 11 0 0 0;
>#P connect 10 0 0 0;
>#P connect 6 0 0 0;
>#P connect 6 1 0 1;
>#P connect 6 1 7 0;
>#P connect 6 0 7 0;
>#P connect 4 0 2 1;
>#P connect 4 0 3 1;
>#P connect 3 0 5 1;
>#P connect 2 0 5 0;
>#P connect 1 0 0 0;
>#P connect 0 0 9 0;
>#P connect 0 0 2 0;
>#P connect 0 1 3 0;
>#P connect 0 1 8 0;
>#P pop;
>

chek d!sz 1 !nzted : !t = verkx.

max v2;
#N vpatcher 9 51 830 561;
#P hidden message 145 131 34 196617 mix 0;
#P hidden message 146 95 34 196617 mix 1;
#P hidden user meter~ 150 240 230 253 100;
#P hidden user meter~ 340 232 420 245 100;
#P hidden user meter~ 479 134 559 147 100;
#P hidden newex 428 97 29 196617 adc~;
#P hidden user ezdac~ 254 340 298 373 -1779630080;
#P hidden user number~ 369 258 408 273 9 3 3 1 0. 0. 0 0.43 250 0.;
#P hidden newex 287 304 27 196617 *~;
#P hidden newex 254 304 27 196617 *~;
#P hidden message 225 116 26 196617 plug;
#P hidden newex 254 195 110 196617 vst~ none;
#P hidden connect 11 0 0 0;
#P hidden connect 10 0 0 0;
#P hidden connect 6 0 0 0;
#P hidden connect 6 1 0 1;
#P hidden connect 6 0 7 0;
#P hidden connect 6 1 7 0;
#P hidden connect 4 0 2 1;
#P hidden connect 4 0 3 1;
#P hidden connect 3 0 5 1;
#P hidden connect 2 0 5 0;
#P hidden connect 1 0 0 0;
#P hidden connect 0 0 9 0;
#P hidden connect 0 1 3 0;
#P hidden connect 0 0 2 0;
#P hidden connect 0 1 8 0;
#P pop;

-
look at english - for all of the cultural financial and military power
behind it
after well over a hundred years in india it is _still_ only a second
language for
almost all the indians that speak it [who of course make up a small
percentage of all indians]
> the flipside:  in india - there is _one_ language that unites the _entire_
>country.
>> no. it unites the entire _elite_. there is a difference.    _
>>europaworldnet.projekt.98o
     m         9         n         d         f         u         k         c
|r|e|s|!|z|t| hegel.s hyzter!k theatre - enjo! ur z!mptomz | de!x!z |+|
d!zkurz!v role

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 16:51:40 +0200
From:    Manuel poletti 
Subject: check failed zgetfn

I had  this problem too when I tried to open a patch containing several
graphic objects and loading some large pict files to be displayed inside
the graphic objects; the opening had to be automatic and the problem
appeared when Max seemed to not find the TIME to load everything correctly;
so I had to put some large delays (100/200ms) between the different
loadbangs of my patch and the problem disappeared ; now I don't know if
this depends of the machine's speed.

Hope this helps a bit.

Manuel Poletti

Ircam Forum technical support
tel : (33) (0)1 44 78 16 05
email : forum-support@ircam.fr

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 12:43:39 -0400
From:    Christopher Murtagh 
Subject: Re: MSP & MOTU 2408

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, David Zicarelli wrote:
> After enduring almost daily e-mail inquiries for the last few
> months asking whether MSP would work with the MOTU 2408, I'm
> pleased to announce that I have in fact made the two work
> together using MSP's new ASIO driver, and I thought I would share
> the remarkably good results from the latency test patcher (included
> with the MSP Examples).

YEAH!! This is great! I just bought a 2408, and man is it ever fantastic.
The software that comes with it also (Audio Desk) is super, very much like
Digital Performer without MIDI. It also supports Digital format conversion
in stand-alone mode to convert TDIF to and from ADAT lightpipe. Truly a
great card.

 Thanks for enduring the emails David. I guess I should now buy MSP. Say,
does it run under MAX 2.5.2? :) (I'll probably have to upgrade that too).

Cheers,

Chris

------------------------------

Date:    Mon, 19 Oct 1998 01:35:00 +0900
From:    nobuyasu sakonda 
Subject: Re: granular

Thanks for many interestings on my msp granular patch.

I have just uploaded it at,

http://www.marin.or.jp/sako/granular1.2.sit.bin

try it and send me your comment.

----------------------------------------------------------
SAKONDA Nobuyasu (composer, author of 'Magical MAX Tour')

5-4-8-603, Oishi-higashimachi, Nada, Kobe, 657-0043 Japan
phone & fax:  +81-(0)78-882-2263
email: sako@marin.or.jp / pxd01307@nifty.ne.jp
homepage: http://www.bekkoame.or.jp/~nsakonda/Welcome.html

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 19:28:09 +0200
From:    "Dr. Karlheinz Essl" 
Subject: changing the background color of a window

Dear MAXers!

Is it possible to change the background color of a ordinary MAX window
(e.g. to black instead of white) - if so, how can it be achieved?

Thanks and cheers,

   Dr. Karlheinz Essl - Composer
   Vienna / Austria
   Studio for Advanced Music & Media Technology
   http://www.essl.at/

------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 10:28:35 -0700
From:    Patrice Coulombe 
Subject: Re: adcvstautobonbaszdl!fe4mz

Strange humor antiorp...

> chek d!sz 1 !nzted : !t = verkx.
>
>
> max v2;
> #N vpatcher 9 51 830 561;
> #P hidden message 145 131 34 196617 mix 0;
> #P hidden message 146 95 34 196617 mix 1;
> #P hidden user meter~ 150 240 230 253 100;
> #P hidden user meter~ 340 232 420 245 100;
> #P hidden user meter~ 479 134 559 147 100;
> #P hidden newex 428 97 29 196617 adc~;
> #P hidden user ezdac~ 254 340 298 373 -1779630080;
> #P hidden user number~ 369 258 408 273 9 3 3 1 0. 0. 0 0.43 250 0.;
> #P hidden newex 287 304 27 196617 *~;
> #P hidden newex 254 304 27 196617 *~;
> #P hidden message 225 116 26 196617 plug;
> #P hidden newex 254 195 110 196617 vst~ none;
> #P hidden connect 11 0 0 0;
> #P hidden connect 10 0 0 0;
> #P hidden connect 6 0 0 0;
> #P hidden connect 6 1 0 1;
> #P hidden connect 6 0 7 0;
> #P hidden connect 6 1 7 0;
> #P hidden connect 4 0 2 1;
> #P hidden connect 4 0 3 1;
> #P hidden connect 3 0 5 1;
> #P hidden connect 2 0 5 0;
> #P hidden connect 1 0 0 0;
> #P hidden connect 0 0 9 0;
> #P hidden connect 0 1 3 0;
> #P hidden connect 0 0 2 0;
> #P hidden connect 0 1 8 0;
> #P pop;

So, it should works...That's what I thought.
meaby a problem with my setup...
Thanks.

==
-----------------------------
Patrice Coulombe
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
patrice_coulombe@yahoo.com
-----------------------------

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------------------------------

Date:    Sun, 18 Oct 1998 22:30:25 +0200
From:    Oeyvind Brandtsegg 
Subject: max vs. c

As Manuel Poletti kindly pointed out regarding my "check failed zgetfn"
question, max seems to have problems with scheduling processes "for
later execution" if it gets bogged down with just too much operations to
perform at a given time.
This might or migh not be true with "plain vanilla C" programs, I don't
know because I haven't got started with C yet. I will...

This leads me to the next question:
Is a max-made patch or standalone a lot slower at executing commands
than a program containing the same functionality, but programmed in C
straigh away ?
The question assumes that both programs are as optimized as possible
regarding execution speed.

If so, does that mean that max is merely for prototyping, and testing
out stuff quickly, and for programs that are supposed to be used on a
limited basis ? So that "commercial" programs are better made with plain
vanilla C ?

Oeyvind Brandtsegg

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End of MAX Digest - 17 Oct 1998 to 18 Oct 1998 (#1998-40)
*********************************************************