Subject: MAX Digest - 13 Jul 1998
Date: Tue, 14 Jul 1998 00:01:42 -0400
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - interactive music/multimedia standard environments
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 3 messages totalling 190 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. MAX Digest - 13 Jul 1998 - Special issue
  2. I will stop now...
  3. Vision vs Logic (was Re: am I a legal owner ?


Date:    Mon, 13 Jul 1998 18:58:12 -0700
From:    James Livingston 
Subject: Re: MAX Digest - 13 Jul 1998 - Special issue

>Date:    Tue, 14 Jul 1998 00:17:14 +0200
>From:    Roby Steinmetzer 
>Subject: still waiting for a new authorization disk......., j'en ai
>James Livingston,
>nice to have unofficial opcode presence on the max list, thanks for it.
>Perhaps you can explain why I have to wait for two (2) months for an
> authorization disk replacement?

No, I can not.  The best thing to do in a situation such as this is to
contact your local distributor and request the disks from them (if you are
an international customer) or the Opcode Customer Service Department
(650-856-3333;  If you have already placed an order and
you are still waiting for it to be filled then I would suggest that you
contact whomever it was that you placed the order with.

>If Opcode is using an unreliable copy protection system, I don't see why I
> should have the problems with it.
>I try to earn money with Max but that's impossible like that.

Opcode will not rev the version of the copy protection used for any old
version of software.  As far as I have been made aware (I do attend the
weekly tech support meetings) there have been no significant recurring
problems with the copy protection used for the 3.5.8 Key Disks (the last
time key disks rev'ed).  Therefore, it is unlikely that there will be any
changes in the near future to the Copy Protection scheme that is currently
in place.

>So, as I don't know how long I have to wait for the disk I ask again:
>Does anyone know how to crack this copy protection system?
>This seems to be the only way that I can do my job.
>I asked for it some weeks ago but the enthusiasm was rather poor.
>So come on you hackers and crackers out there, don't be afraid, there's
> illegal to post it.

I think that in general you will find that hackers and crackers are a
rather self sufficient bunch who are not likely to hand hold you through
the process of figuring out what they have learned to do on their own.  It
is also unlikely that they would choose to expose information which could
be used to locate /identify them in a public forum.

As for extra key disks ("Professionals always have a backup."), if you are
having problems obtaining key disks from your local distributor then you
should contact the Opcode US Customer Service department (650-856-3333; to inform them of the problem and they will be happy to
try to resolve your issues as expeditiously as they can.

>Date:    Mon, 13 Jul 1998 20:52:46 -0400
>From:    Jeff Mann 
>Subject: Re: am I a legal owner ?
>James Livingston  wrote:
>> Opcode discontinued the transferral of registrations approximately a year
>> and a half ago, which would mean that you are welcome to use the software
>[provided, I assume, that Mr. X didn't keep a copy]
>> but would not receive over the phone technical support, be notified of
>> upgrades, be eligible fo r upgrade pricing, or the purchase of additional
>> authorization disks .
>This is a surprising statement. James, would you mind double-checking
>this and confirming it?

For double checking and confirmation you will need to contact Customer
Service (650-856-3333; as they will have the most up to
date information and since my statements on this list should not be
construed as "The Voice of Opcode."

> I bought Studio Vision Pro, which I paid a lot
>of money for, and then bought Logic Audio. Now I should just toss Studio
>Vision in the trash? I can't sell my copy of Max so that I can buy a
>nice Linux box and run Pd? No way! I've never heard of such a thing. As
>I said, I would think that Opcode's written consent for a license
>transfer can't be unreasonably withheld, so I would encourage people not
>to put up with this. Any Californian lawyers out there?

Huh?  I don't follow your reasoning here but, as I said before...

If you bought a computer and it has a bunch of Opcode software installed on
it, you are welcome to use that software to your heart's content.  However,
if you expect that you will be eligible for technical support, upgrade
pricing, or backup disks for whatever program and version was installed
(which the REGISTERED  license holder is eligible for) then you are

Until this policy was changed (~18 months ago) Opcode would transfer a
license from the REGISTERED original owner to the new owner (with the
signed consent of both parties) for a fee of $25 US.  Last I heard Opcode
will no longer transfer software licenses from the original individual who
registered a specific serialized copy of any software to any other
individual for a fee, for free, or otherwise.

For the "Official" answer contact Opcode Customer Support (650-856-3333; or your local distributor.




Date:    Mon, 13 Jul 1998 19:33:49 -0800
From:    Gene Schwartz 
Subject: Re: I will stop now...

Condensed version. I will stop now after repeating all of the invalid
arguments and accusations that I originally made. I want the last word.

>I admit that I've let my end of this get a bit out hand, and this
>will be my final post on the subject.
>The original issue was simply a question of whether or not a =
>person owning an unlicensed or unpurchased copy of Max should get
>*detailed* help on specific issues from the list, such as an
>entire chapter from the manual devoted to making collectives.
>My original post on the subject was to suggest (and not so
>unkindly) that this was not entirely proper.  This is an issue
>that pertains to Max, albeit in the area of intellectual
>property.  This was not a personal attack on the person
>asking the question, but rather a general response on an issue
>of intellectual property.  However, rather than discuss it in =
>any rational fashion, I was personally attacked by the self-
>appointed guardian of the right-to-steal movement, to which I =
>responded in like fashion (my mistake, sinking to the level =
>of the attacker).
>I apologize for getting carried away with the name-calling;
>here's just the points which I should have listed:
>1) Intellectual property laws do exist.
>2) Software Licenses do not allow you to give away extra
>copies when you sell your computer.
>3) It may therefore be improper for people with such
>licensing problems to be essentially requesting sections
>of the users manual from the list.
>4) antiorp normally writes in a difficult to read,
>machine-like pseudo-german, making it difficult at best
>and time consuming to figure out what he's saying,
>*except* when he's requesting money for sales of *his*
>intellectual property.
>5) which is hypocritical considering he's all for stealing
>software if one doesn't have the money to buy it.
>I'll now return to the development of intellectual property,
>and hopefully the list can return to normally scheduled =
>programming.  Further responses should be sent to me directly.
>Stephen Kay


Date:    Mon, 13 Jul 1998 22:22:13 -0400
From:    David Crandall 
Subject: Vision vs Logic (was Re: am I a legal owner ?

On Mon, 13 Jul 1998, Jeff Mann wrote:

> I bought Studio Vision Pro, which I paid a lot
> of money for, and then bought Logic Audio.

If you don't mind, why did you pick Logic over Vision?  I'm trying to make
a decision about upgrading my MIDI sequencer.



PS- oh, and how well does it work with Max?  (ha! *now* it's on-topic...)


End of MAX Digest - 13 Jul 1998