Subject: MAX Digest - 2 Jul 1998 to 3 Jul 1998
Date: Sat, 4 Jul 1998 00:00:13 -0400
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - interactive music/multimedia standard environments
     
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 11 messages totalling 321 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. mody + skreen size
  2. Nubus -> PCI
  3. Nubus
  4. Shrinkwrap License
  5. MSP turns off "listen"
  6. http://www2.cybernex.net/~jonwitte/max/welcome.html
  7. cd object (de nouveau)
  8. MSP turns off "listen" (and OS8 turns it back on)
  9. Mody available (again)
 10. msprofile
 11. G3 playthrough

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 2 Jul 1998 23:35:06 -0600
From:    =cw4t7abs 
Subject: mody + skreen size

>One thing is that you need a screen having a 1024/768 hz (17'')
>frequency in order to see every windows.This is due to the fact that one
>can't save the windows 's positions.Will be corrected soon .Have fun with
>it.Send me your questions.
>
>-MP

!f uze desksize objekt kan rearrange w!ndowz
on ztartup.

mody = ultra zuperb !nterfasz . !mpekabl.
mozt elegant objekt arrangement evr esp b.lo
+ richard dudas' kord = tzzt

no > engl!sh. bzzp.

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 2 Jul 1998 23:28:46 -0700
From:    Philip Aker 
Subject: Re: Nubus -> PCI

I've lost the original poster's eddress but
Second Wave makes PCI->NuBus expansion chassis:

http://www.2ndwave.com/products/xpansion.html

Philip

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 09:54:01 +0300
From:    Ken Gregory 
Subject: Nubus

Hi,
I'suggest keep the Nubus Mac and cards and setting up an Ethernet
connection to the new G3. This way you can avoid losing any productivity.
You'll have to spend an inordinate amount of time and money trying to
reproduce the same functions on the new system. Unless you you like that
sort of thing. Of cource you can spend even more money replacing those
Nubus cards with PCI versions.
It's a spiral.....

Cheers,
ken

PS I still use an AudioMedia II card on a Quadra 840 for all my sound and
Max stuff. I bought this stuff dirt cheap from people dumping their stuff
for the latest and greatest. I get A LOT done not wasting time with bugs,
weirdness, incompatibilities,.......etc. But this is my way.
Ciao

>2.  The school where I teach is finally allowing me to upgrade to a G3 Mac,
>but I am concerned about my Nubus audio cards (Session 8 and SampleCell
>II).  The replacement price from Digidesign is outrageous and I need to be
>able to continue using them.  Does anyone know of a Nubus to PCI riser that
>would allow me to keep the cards plugged into a box that then plugs into
>one of the PCI slots in the new machine?
>

Ken Gregory     kgregory@pangea.ca
704-138 Portage Ave. East
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada R3C 0A1
ph. 204-942-7510  fax 204-942-1555

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 04:17:22 -0400
From:    Nicholas Longo <71477.2332@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Subject: Shrinkwrap License

The following is reposted from a 150+ message thread on misc.int-property
over the last week or so.

Nick Longo

------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm looking into the issues of restricting SW purchasers' rights to
discover the mechanisms or ideas behind a program.  These protections of
ownership aren't granted by patent or copyright, but tend to be terms of
EULA or shrinkwrap licenses.

ProCD v. Zeidenberg (http://www.slwk.com/bullet12.html) holds EULAs to
be enforceable (I've seen a lot of hearsay statements that they're not).

I have a few questions, as usual:

 - What is the general history and/or precedent for EULAs and shrinkwrap
-- who started this?  Is there an implied license of use when I buy
other products (a music CD, a radio, a shirt, bread)?

 - Would it be possible to determine that portions of a contract
ejoining a user from decompiling, reverse engineering, or otherwise
trying to determine the workings of a program are unenforceable?  Has
this been upheld or denied in court?  What penalties have been levied
against individuals or corporations?

 - Is there any parallel for anti-reverse-engineering provisions of SW
EULAs in user licenses in other areas?

 - Outside of requirements which would require criminal activity, what
are the limits on the stipulations which can be made in a EULA?

--
Karsten M. Self (kmself@ix.netcom.com)

    What part of "gestalt" don't you understand?
    Welchen Teil von "gestalt" verstehen Sie nicht?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
In <3590DDAC.468AB0C9@ix.netcom.com> "Karsten M. Self"
 writes:

>ProCD v. Zeidenberg (http://www.slwk.com/bullet12.html) holds EULAs to
>be enforceable (I've seen a lot of hearsay statements that they're not).

EULAs (end-user license agreements) have always been enforceable.  The
once-famous CP/M operating system was once sold under strict licensing
and this did not seem to impact its market.

The difference made by the ProCD case was that NINTPOBSNAEULAs (nearly
invisible tiny print on the bottom never signed never accepted end user
license agrements) were held to be enforceable.

> - What is the general history and/or precedent for EULAs and shrinkwrap
>-- who started this?  Is there an implied license of use when I buy
>other products (a music CD, a radio, a shirt, bread)?

In the Seventh Circuit, if you buy a product that says you may not use
it on Sundays, the condition is binding upon you.  My suggestion
to all consumers:  Move!  To a different Circuit.
--
Rahul Dhesi 
   "Frankly, sir, nobody is that much of an expert on anything, at least
   not on usenet." -- Andy Greenberg 

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 11:07:38 +0200
From:    Jeffrey Burns 
Subject: MSP turns off "listen"

>>When I launch Max with MSP installed, it appears to turn off listen in the
>>Monitors and Sound Control Panel. Is there some way to have MSP running,
>>and still leave listen on so that I can hear the CD playing. That is, I
>>want to monitor the CD, absent any processing through Max or MSP.
>
>You're using a G3 with System 8.0 or System 8.1. This was a
>really stupid "improvement" made in these systems. The moment
>any sound input device is opened, you lose the playthrough
>of the input to the computer.
>
>David Z.
>
This may not be a very high-end solution - but it's cheap. I pulled the
audio wire out of the CD-ROM drive and replaced it by a cable with a 3.5mm
stereo jack at the other end, into which I plug my audio system. The sound
may not be as good as when using an audio board, but it probably benefits
from not being mixed with all the other sounds inside the Mac.

Jeff Burns

http://www.snafu.de/~jeff

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 06:28:49 -0600
From:    =cw4t7abs 
Subject: http://www2.cybernex.net/~jonwitte/max/welcome.html

an+e 1 aksez

http://www2.cybernex.net/~jonwitte/max/welcome.html

+ ?

10      199.95.244.3    nyc2-br3.bbnplanet.net  0.235
11      199.95.232.13   newark-cr1.bbnplanet.net        0.200
12
13
14

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 10:10:41 -0600
From:    Todd Welbourne 
Subject: cd object (de nouveau)

This has got to a simple problem, but I can't think where else to turn but
the list. I cannot open the cd object on my machine (PB1400cs, MAX 3.5.9)
without crashing. In three crashes I got three different error messages
(from Norton Crahsguard): 1) "Illegal instruction exception" 2) "unmapped
memory exeception" 3) "bus error exception".  If I could get to the help
files I might find some relevant information but I can't even get
there--the manual doesn't mention any special setups or drivers needed.
Could it be the object is expecting a SCSI drive whereas the PB CD drive is
IDE??  Any body else having this problem??TW

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 15:10:21 -0700
From:    jhno 
Subject: Re: MSP turns off "listen" (and OS8 turns it back on)

>>When I launch Max with MSP installed, it appears to turn off listen in the
>>Monitors and Sound Control Panel. Is there some way to have MSP running,
>>and still leave listen on so that I can hear the CD playing. That is, I
>>want to monitor the CD, absent any processing through Max or MSP.
>
>You're using a G3 with System 8.0 or System 8.1. This was a
>really stupid "improvement" made in these systems. The moment
>any sound input device is opened, you lose the playthrough
>of the input to the computer.

i have the opposite problem, where i never want to hear the sound input
device except through MSP. so you start up MSP and playthrough is turned
off... fine. but then, eject the cd and put in a new cd: the sound manager
automatically starts playing the cd and turns playthrough back on! ARGH.

so, go to the lovely "monitors and sound" control panel and change the
"monitoring source" to none. playthrough goes away - but now nothing is
coming through msp's adc~ object, even though the DSP Status window still
says CD!

so, finally you change the MSP input source to "none", and then back again
to "CD" - and you are back where you started, hearing the audio input in
MSP without playthrough.

note that at this point the monitors and sound control panel is
inconsistent: it reports that the monitoring source is back to CD with
"listen" on - but it is not playing through...

if anybody knows a workaround, please let me know... for example i want
people to be able to use my looper and put in different cd's to get
different loops. right now it just won't work.

note that these problems only apply when using the sound manager.

-jhno

() ))  (  ((( ))   ) ))))) ( )((()) (  ( ))   (  )    ) (   ((( )  (()( (()
delicate ear                                                 ear@sirius.com
san francisco, ca                                http://www.sirius.com/~ear

------------------------------

Date:    Sat, 4 Jul 1998 01:32:13 +0200
From:    Manuel Poletti-Studio Parlant 
Subject: Mody available (again)

Thanks to Marc Battier (Ircam), you can also download Mody from the Ircam
ftp site:

ftp://ftp.ircam.fr/pub/forumnet/public

where you find three Mody-files that you can download directly when typing:

ftp://ftp.ircam.fr/pub/forumnet/public/Mody_alpha2.sea.bin    (1245k)
(A "standalone" version if you do not own MAX or MAXplay)

ftp://ftp.ircam.fr/pub/forumnet/public/Mody_collective.sea.bin    (422 k)
(A file to be loaded into MAX)

ftp://ftp.ircam.fr/pub/forumnet/public/Mody_doc.sea.bin    (45k)
(Documentation for Mody that everyone can read, although it comes in
French)(english translation in progress:10/15 days...)

Again, if you use it please give me some feed-back.

MPoletti

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 16:45:41 -0700
From:    David Zicarelli 
Subject: msprofile

There is a one-page article on MSP in the August issue of
Keyboard magazine's section on software synthesizers.
Discerning readers will notice that the accompanying screen
shot has nothing to with the caption underneath it.

David Z.

------------------------------

Date:    Fri, 3 Jul 1998 22:49:07 -0400
From:    Jeff Mann 
Subject: G3 playthrough

Hi - I asked this before but got no replies: Isn't there any way to
disable playthrough on a G3 for MSP? It always mixes the original (dry)
signal in with the processed (wet) one. Oh, of course after delaying it
just enough to cause phase cancellations if mixed back in. This is
awful. I need a 100% wet output. Is this a software "feature", or
hardware? Is there something I can cut or solder on my motherboard? Is
there someone I can send threatening letters to at Apple?

I have been told that if you use a PCI audio card like the Korg, this
problem doesn't happen. Too bad I can't afford one, having spent all the
money on the G3... :-(   Grumble.
--
Jeff Mann - Information Consumer ___O___O__= -- >
mailto:jefman@utcc.utoronto.ca ||   http://www.interlog.com/~jefman
Visit the Art & Robotics Group site: http://www.interaccess.org/arg

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End of MAX Digest - 2 Jul 1998 to 3 Jul 1998
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