Subject: MAX Digest - 27 Apr 1998 to 28 Apr 1998
Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:01:24 -0400
From: Automatic digest processor 
Reply-To: MAX - interactive music/multimedia standard environments
To: Recipients of MAX digests 

There are 11 messages totalling 367 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. Max Object List
  2. re Max to C/  sample edit
  3. composition shoot-out
  4. WaveRider
  5. Pauline and Radio
  6. MAX Digest - 25 Apr 1998 to 26 Apr 1998
  7. advice needed (MIDI interface)
  8. Old vs. New World's (2)
  9. overdrive on/off message
 10. no!sz


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 00:02:21 -0400
From:    Ed Hartley 
Subject: Max Object List

Howdy, folks

I just download a bunch of third-party Max objects from the FTP and I
damaged my Max Object List as I was updating it. Now Max crashes as soon as
loads. I'm pretty sure it's the Object List  because Max will load fine if I
it out of the Max folder. Then, of course, I don't get a complete list when
create a new object in a patcher. I opened up the list in a word processor
everything looks OK. (The new objects seem to work OK too, by the way) I
copied and pasted it into a new text window in Max, but no dice, it still
Before I try the labor-intensive task of retyping the whole thing from
does anyone have any ideas about what could be wrong with my list to make
happen? I wonder if there's a limit to the number of objects one can put in
list? My "Unsupported Patches" folder is pushing 150 items.

Thanks in advance,

Ed Hartley


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 10:18:29 +0100
From:    Jem Finer 
Subject: re Max to C/  sample edit

mmmm yes . .

>Here's the real-world procedure:
>1) Learn C programming.
>2) Program your patch from scratch.
>Stephen Kay

I feared this was the case !

and now something completely different -

is their an MSP external that allows one to edit a sample graphically, in
real time, that is look at the waveform and select the loop ?


Jem Finer

Kentish Town
London NW5


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 10:32:56 -0000
From:    Nick Rothwell 
Subject: Re: composition shoot-out

> Perhaps I've got it backwards, but wouldn't an academic in a
> non-academically organized environment be placed at a
> disadvantage?

Not half as much as a non-academic in an academic organisation...

        Nick Rothwell, CASSIEL            contemporary dance projects            music synthesis and control

        NOTICE - this vessel has triple screws - keep clear of blades


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 13:34:29 +0200
From:    Jens Jacobsen 
Subject: Re: WaveRider

Tommy DOG wrote:

> I'm curious if anyone is using the WaveRider with it's Max software.

I've tried it out a few years ago, but despite a lot of helpfull support
WaveRider's  Jonathan Purcell it was impossible for me to make the
Mac/Max-version work. It simply made my Mac freeze when I turned the
on! (I used a Centris660AV, Max 2.5.2 and Max 3.0, OMS 2.02)
So instead we had to use the PC-version.
According to Jonathan Purcell the problems I had at the time should be
with the newer versions of OMS.

Best wishes
Jens Jacobsen

Danish Institute of Electroacoustic Music
Musikhuset Aarhus, Denmark


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 09:41:24 -0500
From:    "Richard Paske (Richard Paske)" 
Subject: Pauline and Radio

Peter Castine wrote:
>Actually, there are a few people in the US composing outside academia, too
>(Oliveros >comes to mind).

Coincidentally, last Saturday I talked to Terry Riley after his concert
with Zeitgeist in Minneapolis and he told me that she has accepted a
three-year teaching position at Mills College in Oakland, CA.

He also wrote:
>20th C. music does get played by the major stations in Germany (which are
>state-funded but have a guarantee of independence from government), but
>it's mostly
>from 11:00 pm to midnight, maybe three times a week. There are a few
>stations in the same ballpark.

For those of you within range of our not-so-powerful transmitter I
broadcast such music, along with jazz from Coltrane and Ornette forward,
every Tuesday from 10:30 PM - midnight on my show "Fresh Ears" on KFAI,
90.3 and 106.7 FM, Minneapolis-St. Paul.  If any of you have recordings
you'd like considered for airplay, send 'em to the address in my sig.  Btw,
we celebrate our 20th anniversary of community radio in May.  At 2 PM on
May 31 my trio will perform a live broadcast from Minneapolis Community and
Technical College to celebrate our first live music broadcast back in 1978.
Sorry, no Max - just my physical digits on faux ivory, along with bass and

Richard Paske

Richard Paske-Snowcloud Communications-1189 Laurel Ave.-St. Paul, MN 55104 "00"'s are zeroes)-
Music (Composed and Improvised)-Digital Audio -Multimedia Design and
Production -Education -Radio Production -Creative Services


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 10:01:32 -0600
From:    Jon Christopher Nelson 
Subject: Re: MAX Digest - 25 Apr 1998 to 26 Apr 1998

Nick Longo wrote:

>Of course, these are professors who get $70,000 salaries plus
>benefits and only work nine or ten months a year.  They don't get
>many $10,000 grants anymore though, since the NEA funds have been

I would venture to bet that on average your salary figure of
$70,000 is about $30,000 too high.  Although our teaching
commitments are typically 9 month commitments, we still must work
(generating compositions and producing research) during the summer
to keep our positions.  However, we do not get paid for this work.
You can think of the situation as being unemployed during the summer
while being expected to put in loads of work.  I would also venture
to guess that most academics, at least those in tenure track
positions, work in excess of 60 hours per week year round.
Certainly the time commitments for tasks other than composing are
rather ominous and can put a damper on one's creative output.
Nonetheless, I also have to admit that I like teaching so the
arduous schedule is worth the effort.

Nicholas was also responding to this:
<<>Why is it that composers/academics/researchers/blahblahblah
<<>having all this money/facilities/support don't do anything
<<>worth listening to?

Support for facilities remains a very difficult problem at most
American universities.  Very few studios have any annual budget and
we are often pitted against other music colleagues in an annual
battle for funding.  The comment regarding not doing anything worth
listening to is certainly a subjective comment that one can make
about any composer, regardless of his or her country of origin or
academic position.

I am guessing that being a composer in Europe is also a difficult
enterprise---commissions are not that easy to get, government
support for the arts is dwindling world-wide, and there are very few
academic posts for composers in Europe.  I don't think it is
productive to compare situations and moan and groan about how much
worse our situation is than another composer's.  It seems to be much
more healthy to support each other despite our aesthetic
differences, acknowledging that the plight of composers everywhere
is a big problem that will not vanish in the near future.

Pardon my rambling, these are just my idle thoughts on the matter
at hand.

with warmest regards from an American academic,

Jon Christopher Nelson, Director
CEMI (Center for Experimental Music and Intermedia)
University of North Texas College of Music
P.O. Box 13887
Denton, TX 76203

ph. (940) 369-7531
fax (940) 565-2002


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 17:22:15 +0200
From:    "Dr. Karlheinz Essl" 
Subject: advice needed (MIDI interface)

Dear friends!

Please apologize this slight off-topic, but I need your advice. For an
installation I need a Macintosh MIDI interface which should cover the
following issues:

        * min. 3 MIDI-in
        * min. 4 MIDI-out
        * continuous controller pedal-in (min. 1, 2 would be great)
        * small
        * OMS compatible

No SMPT-sync or ADAT-sync etc. is needed!

According to my own searches on the web, MOTU's MicroExpress would fulfill
all requirements except that you can only adjust on pedal switch (and not a
continous expression pedal).

BTW, I am also looking for a MIDI-Merger for at least 3 sources and came
across the MIDI Merger Units of Phil Rees:

Does anyone have any experiences with these products?

Please reply directly by email to

Thanks in advance,

   Dr. Karlheinz Essl - Composer
   Vienna / Austria
   Studio for Advanced Music & Media Technology


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:46:09 -0400
From:    Nicholas Longo <71477.2332@COMPUSERVE.COM>
Subject: Re: Old vs. New World's

For clarification, the $70,000 figure was divulged to me in 1985 as the
annual salary of a full tenured professor in the University of California
system.  I expect it has gone up since then.  I don't know what salaries
are at private universities, but there are some administrators who claim
they are the reason for skyrocketing tuition costs.

As for me I didn't want to be a professor.  I love top 40, especially the
new techno-derived stuff with vocals that could have come straight out of
Motown.  Madonna's new hit is great.  She makes more than any professor of
course.  But then she's not an elitist.


Date:    Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:34:45 +1000
From:    David Rodger 
Subject: Re: Old vs. New World's

Peter Castine wrote:
>Stockhausen is not your average composer. Karlheinz has been _very_
>clever at playing his cards (with fame his trump suit) to maximize
>income. I don't want to publicly say the guy is greedy, but he's no less
>so than Chopin. (And don't get me started about his Wagnerian behavior at
>Darmstadt two years ago.)

Stockhausen's or Chopin's?  Well, I suppose Chopin's behaviour _would_ be
very much like Wagner's since both of them are dead.   ;-)

Regards, David

David Rodger ------------ Audio Engineer, Pool Lifeguard, RLSS Trainer
Personal:     (not yet exciting)
Research:   (a bit more exciting)
"Officially the La Trobe Music Department is in existance for the next
2 years and will close on 31 December, 1999.  (This is really just our
way of avoiding the Y2K bug)."                          -- David Hirst


Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 23:05:40 -0400
From:    Eric Singer 
Subject: overdrive on/off message


Does anyone know the message to send to ;max to turn overdrive on/off?
(It's not 'overdrive' BTW)



Date:    Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:37:23 -0600
From:    =cw4t7abs 
Subject: no!sz

>>Perhaps I've got it backwards, but wouldn't an academic in a
>>non-academically organized environment be placed at a

not az terr!bl+e az s!t 1 akadem!k would b !n were d!sz 2b. 1 web des!gn
1 area where akadem!kx fa!l m!zerabl+e. + 1 > area wh!ch dep!ktz akadem!k
fa!lure !n general.
d!sz =3D n!szt 1 v!z!td thuz far
[prov!ng dzat !f konsept not eas!l+e !ngezt!bl v!a 1 ekuat!on akadem!kx =3D

>An arguable statement to be sure. I only have time to outline a response:
>I. My feeling is that "academia" is a unique musical culture, with its own
>asthetics and reward system. If you  are not a member of the culture, you
>may find the music unaccessable.

dynam!k relatd 2 absensz ov kasch.
appl!ez 2 book matter az well.

>III. Contrary to popular opinion, academics have a lot more to do than
>write music. You don't get $70k a year for creative work, you get it for
>going to committee meetings and (gasp) teaching courses.

zelekt humanz rece!v $0.0k 4 dzose v.akt!v!t!ez
+ zelekt humanz =3D sku!sch sku!sch by both
korporate + akadem!k konglomeratez.

>"oh, I'm gonna give up on doing concerts, I think I'm gonna just write
>music to play for my wife."

He claims it was a visit to the washroom in O'Hare Airport that
      prompted him to ask, "Shouldn't my computer be as smart as this

s.p.C.a.  soc!et+e 4 dze prevent!on ov kruelt+e 2 automata hTTp://
s v3 r ! g3. 1 9 9 8 o || a m 3 r ! k c a 5 u g 3 r
[c]  v ! R u s |+| p u N K t  . p R =F8p 2 g4 n d2 z !5 t 3m m.-e


End of MAX Digest - 27 Apr 1998 to 28 Apr 1998